VIDEO – MIRACLES AT WALMART – Please Watch!!

Torben Sondergaard is an old friend of mine from Denmark – a preacher of righteousness who often sees God do amazing miracles on the streets. Recently he was visiting America and saw God do wonderful healings in the open air right across the USA – even in Walmart! He believes a new “Reformation” is coming to the church. Please share this wonderful video as widely as you can-



Posted in TV & Videos by Andrew on June 27th, 2013 at 10:31 am.

156 comments

156 Replies

  1. Video would not come up! However, I originally got on this site in response to email from D.Wilkerson just to say I agree with his last email in that Holiness and separation from sin is the work of the Holy Spirit in these last days. I have read and been taught so much from this ministry for 40 years now!! Thank you , thank you, thank you…! Donna Long

  2. Awesome!! I left this page up and after awhile the video played!! Praise the Lord!! Holy Spirit stirring within from watching this…thank you Holy Spirit for transferable anointing for miracles… lead to pray right now then go to Walmart!! Donna Long

  3. missbridgewater Jun 27th 2013

    cheap immitations same as the egyptian priests…

  4. L roberts Jun 27th 2013

    I agree totally with missbridgewater and am surprised Andrew endorses this stuff. No different to the todd bentley brigade. Only repentance will bring true healing. Am confused why this is being pushed?

  5. Torben Jun 27th 2013

    I have a question for missbridgewater an L roberts
    Will you ever say good for healings and miracles that happen today?

    Or is it just about to preach repentance without healing and deliverance, etc?

    If you answer yes that healing happen today, why do you then reject this video without knowing what is being preached?

  6. It is always good to see Jesus healing people . We don’t deserve it but because The Lord God is good he is willing to heal and deliver and save.

  7. Torben Jun 27th 2013

    L Robert maybe you should watch the whole video .. There is much more than the girls with legs. The lame lady which is healed etc.. The gospel is also preached, you just can not see it in this video .. but visit the website TheLastReformation.com and I find repentance and other good things…

  8. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    AMEN!
    The GOODNESS OF GOD is what draws mankind to the cross, not bashing them over the head with scripture.

    Jesus bashed the RELIGIOUS people with scriptures…….not the ordinary men and women of the day.

    THE PRESENCE AND POWER of Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit ARE the Goodness of God.

    When people SEE the GOODNESS of God FLOWING IN AND FROM US, then their SPIRITS/HEARTS open up and are drawn to KNOW THIS JESUS WHO JUST LOVED ON THEM.

    Jesus did it THIS WAY!!! If its good enough for Jesus, its good enough for me.

    UNBELIEF IS THE ROOT OF ALL SIN.

  9. At the 4:45 minute mark this man has the girl ask the HOLY Spirit to come, which she does. Upon opening her eyes, she exclaims, “Yo, that sh*t is gone”. REALLY? The HOLY Spirit came to her and delivered her or healed her? I thought the HOLY Spirit was sent to earth to CONVICT of sin. But not with these crowds. The HOLY Spirit, thru this man, supposedly comes and performs signs and healings for these sinners, and leaves them right in their sin!!!! FORGET preaching repentance from sin … that was sooooo yesterday. (I think a great song we could all sign together right now would be, “Let me entertain you”.)

    A GREAT expose on faith healing/faith healers was done by Brit Derren Brown. You can find it on YouTube: Derren Brown – Miracles For Sale.

    And before I get slammed let it be known I have been a missionary to Hindus, and still preach to the unsaved in the U.S. now that I am home. I have seen MANY wonderful, true and lasting miracles and healings AFTER the sick person would hear the Gospel, REPENT, and ask the Lord for salvation and eternal life. Biblical? Mark 16:17-18 says PREACH the Gospel and then these signs will follow.

    But now, let the boxing gloves be put on and the fight begin. Those who love signs and wonders will post comments and slam those who say this video is all a show displaying false healings since there was no Gospel preached. Deceiving and being deceived. What a shame. Holiness and picking up the cross was starting to be discussed in the very recent last post by Andrew, entitled “THE LAST OUTPOURING – David Wilkerson” … only to be dismissed and quickly erased from memory as this newest controversy hits this site.

    John 16:7 – if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you. But if I go, I will send him to you. 8 – And when he comes, he will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment…

  10. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    Rom 2:4 NASB – Or do you think lightly of THE RICHES of His kindness and tolerance and patience, not knowing that
    THE KINDNESS OF GOD LEADS YOU TO REPENTANCE?

    What must we suffer for our hardened hearts to be broken before the Lord for our LACK OF MERCY?

    Mercy toward us is measured by our mercy toward others…check the parables. As well as forgiveness.

  11. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    Consider ALL the healings/miracles that were done in the OT and NT. (including the nation of Israel as a whole)

    Very few had repented BEFORE the healings/miracles.
    Many, but NOT ALL, repented AFTER.
    Some received the miracle/healing and did not repent at all…..

    People haven’t changed through out all of time.

  12. Jesus told us repeatedly to preach the gospel, heal the sick and cast out demons. His kingdom comes in power. It causes people to believe.

    John 20:30-31 (NKJV) And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

    We ought to be doing all three. God confirms His word of grace with signs following. Watch this video about the glory of God:
    http://youtu.be/03hWzOCzZ9k

  13. It all boils down to this, if you never believe the Lord can do these things through you, He never will. I for one choose to believe Jesus when he said “Greater things than these shall YOU do.” We should preach the gospel of Christ EXPECTING signs, wonders and miracles (hearings and deliverance) to follow to confirm the message preached that YES, JESUS IS ALIVE! Believe the LORD!

  14. Tilman Jun 27th 2013

    Yes, I agree that miracles also happen without repentance – but people have to repent. The problem of this world is NOT sickness, the problem of this world is SIN.

    I am sorry for being so harsh and legalistic, honestly. I really want to love Jesus AND my fellowman, and I hope Andrew and his ministry will be blessed. But, we ALL must stick to the word. And it’s a fact that 5.000 men HEARED Jesus three days without having food before Jesus provided them with bread and fish.

    “Then Jesus called his disciples unto him, and said, I have compassion on the multitude, because they continue with me now three days, and have nothing to eat: and I will not send them away fasting, lest they faint in the way” (Mt 15:32, KJB).

    Obviously, there is no need to preach the gospel any longer, since we now can change people in a second. For me it looks as if the gospel is offered as a sale – and that seems to be the problem. Jesus asked us to abdicate everyting we have – otherwise we CAN’T BE be his disciples. Shouldn’t we teach that any longer? I know this doesn’t sound popular, but didn’t Jesus teach us to make disciples, and which one is a true disciple if not this one:

    “If ye continue in my WORD, then are ye my disciples indeed” (John 8:31, KJB).

    I will stop now arguing, but I have one simple question: If this man didn’t preach the gospel before the healing, who will do it after him?

  15. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    George Delo……Amen and thank you for that message.

    I was truly blessed and it made my day “Lighter”.

  16. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    oops….forgot to say “video message”

  17. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    May I ask some of the above posters this question:

    Why aren’t the people falling down on their faces in repentance when you or anyone preaches the cross; forgiveness of sins; Jesus Christ??

  18. Vicki Lynn Jun 27th 2013

    Why was Jesus name not mentioned when asking/thanking for healing most times.

    I guess that concerned me.

  19. WELL said, Robert and Tilman!

    As the serpent wanted Jesus to perform a miracle to prove that He was Son of God (Luke 4) … “Come on Jesus, perform for me! Prove that you really are the Son of God” … so the serpent is egging Christians on too! “Come on people, if you think you are God’s Children, perform signs and wonders. Prove you are God’s Children. Prove that you can do greater works than Jesus. Prove it, prove it, prove it.”

    And so in the lust to be just like the Most High God (Isaiah 14:14), people flock to ‘schools’ to learn how to perform, and then take their new found power to the streets to show off and all the while the unsaved perish and die and go to Hell.

    Signs and Wonders do not save people or cause them to repent. Preaching causes people to be saved, and GOD will confirm the Word of repentance with signs following: Mark 16:20 – “Then the disciples went out and preached everywhere, and the Lord worked with them and confirmed His word by the signs that accompanied it”

    IsChristSoonToReturn

  20. So no one got healed , the gospel was not preached , no one repented , and it is not “of God”. You could only be so blind if The Lord has given you over to a hardened heart. You can’t see Jesus at work.

    If it is Jesus healing , saving and delivering then you have called His works evil. And it is Jesus .

  21. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    JeffM…..I believe you are referring to “blaspheming the Holy Spirit” when you call His works evil.

    Luk 9:49 NKJV – Now John answered and said, “Master, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name, and WE FORBADE him BECAUSE HE DOES NOT FOLLOW WITH US.”

    Luk 9:50 NKJV – But Jesus said to him, “Do not forbid [him], for he who is not against us is on our side.”

  22. Excerpt from Torben Søndergaard’s article:

    “We’ve lost the GOSPEL”
    This article “We’ve lost Touch of Message” has been published in the Danish Christian newspaper “challenge” (The Challenge). The sad thing is that today it is more about believing in God and not about Jesus Christ and the Cross. But it is not enough if you believe in God. One must believe in Jesus and the Cross.

    It is a must that people repent and believe the GOSPEL in order to be saved.
    It’s sad but truth be told, it appears that we have lost touch of the GOSPEL in many areas of our churches.
    Satan has unfortunately succeeded in persecuting the church, resulting in us losing the most important and precious of all: the GOSPEL of Jesus Christ and the Cross.

    What do you mean we’ve lost the GOSPEL?
    Well, I mean that we have shot to the left of the bulls-eye when it comes to Jesus Christ and the cross.
    We aim incorrectly and therefore strike incorrectly, which in reality means that we are presenting a false Message; which in turn creates a false hope with many being that they have set their confidence in something that cannot save them! Let me explain: Jesus says that we should repent and believe in the GOSPEL (Mark 1:15). We must repent of our sins and our own way and believe in the GOSPEL about Him. It’s all about us turning from our sins and giving Him permission to be our Lord – if we are to be saved (Romans 10:9).
    Life starts at the Cross

    http://www.thelastreformation.com/lost-the-gospel.html

    Excerpt from Torben Søndergaard’s book:
    Decieved? (2002)

    I wish that this message will uncover a deceive in our world. A deceive that was brought to the world by religious traditions of God’s word and make a false picture of who God is and what it will say to be a Christian. The truth is no church membership, baptism, confirmation, speaking in tongues will save you if you still live in disobedience and sin.
    http://www.thelastreformation.com/decieved.html

    The author of the film (same as above excerpts) has stated that the film is a composition of ‘little clips’ from six places he visited in America, so who can truly say what prefaced or followed those snippets.

    His website looks sound to me – so far.

  23. Tilman Jun 27th 2013

    Good point, Jeff, everybody got healed by Jesus, although nobody heard the Good News, or almost nothing. But may I ask a few questions then:

    Why does (or did?) Andrew then preach so passionately about a clean conscience? Why wouldn’t I have a clean robe before Jesus when I hadn’t experienced a sound conversion as a Christian – but these people on the street get saved without any change in their hearts? Do we have now a two-tier Christianity?

    Ok, let’s assume they will repent later – why don’t we talk about repentance in the first place? I heard the story about a girl who wrote on a paper slip – after hearing the gospel – “Tomorrow I will repent.” The next day she was killed in an accident.

    Why do we hear all the times about John Wesley and Charles Finney and how fervently they preached – even to Christians? Why was that necessary? Answer me! Why is it said in Acts 3:37 that they were “pricked in their heart” after hearing Peter preaching?

    How many healings occurred in Acts without preaching? Not many. Why do these signs FOLLOW those who believe? What’s the Great Comission in Mt 28? To make disciples and TEACH them.

    But wasn’t it Andrew who preached all the time, we CANNOT FIND the true gospel in the church anymore, because we’ve lost it?! To which church will you send these people on the road, if there is almost no church left to preach the full gospel? Why do we think it’s other peoples’ business to do that?

    Don’t you see these contradictions? Isn’t it ridiculous to have an article on this website like “We have lost the Gospel” and then when it comes to preaching – we have a zero preaching ministry? I am not the counselor of this ministry, but this is the message I heard on RS over and over.

    To finish that: My explanation for these healings is that God likes to heal unbelieving people to show his power – that they might start believing. So far so good. But then the teaching should follow! Or even the baptism if necessary. If not, it’s unlikely that these people are saved! That’s direct quote Andrew Strom.

    If you can grasp the gospel just in a moment – even without prayer – then forget half of the sermons on Revival School, because people get saved much more easily!

  24. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    Why do these signs FOLLOW those who believe?

    The signs (manifestation of His Presence and Power), in this case healings, FLOW THROUGH the one who believes…….. outward to others.

    George Delo, a post above, has posted a video that explains it very well…..about 30 minutes long.

  25. Tilman , it makes more sense once you realize how completely protestant christianity has failed to be Christ’s church. Jesus has had it with the system and is moving on, we are in a time of turmoil as God does what He has decided to do. There is only one safe voice to listen to , God the Father.

    Jesus himself is our salvation and He won’t stay with anyone who does not treat Him like He is Lord , to be obeyed. If people find Jesus out on the street and follow Him only , then they are being saved. Salvation only exists in the present tense , getting saved means nothing ,it is in the past. Are we being saved right now because we will love and obey God the Father right now ?

    So if things look like a huge mess, its because it is a huge mess and even worse . Few seem willing to admit protestant religion is as false as catholic religion. Jesus must rule over us all , and I do mean directly. He tells each of us what to do, or we don’t know Him.

    I don’t see the Lord as willing to keep trying to fix church as it has been. We have Jesus to follow and must reject anything that would stop us. So there is hope but only in Him.

  26. Strait out application of ;

    Mar 16:15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.
    Mar 16:16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.
    Mar 16:17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues;
    Mar 16:18 they will pick up serpents with their hands; and if they drink any deadly poison, it will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

    The above verses are saying if we believe and know Jesus we can use His authority over the works of the enemy , as do the following verses ;

    Luk 10:17 The seventy-two returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in your name!”
    Luk 10:18 And he said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.
    Luk 10:19 Behold, I have given you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall hurt you.

    The people receiving prayer all showed a significant change in there eyes after prayer , showing that spirit had left them.

    I have seen our Lord work like this in the past , where step one is to reach people be His Spirit , which is what we saw on the video.

    It doesn’t matter about follow up or baptism or handing out bibles at this stage , as now they have the Holy Spirit who will call them unto His truth , and after a bit of an internal struggle , many of those prayed for will go on to commit their lives to Jesus in a way that is not possible if the Holy Spirit is not calling us unto Jesus.

  27. If we know Jesus , and He knows us , we have all that we need to follow after Him .

    Through His death and resurrection , and the sending of His Holy Spirit , He has given us all that we need to serve Him effectively.

    The only limitation is us !

  28. Andrew Jun 27th 2013

    I am totally disgusted by the anti-healing brigade on here.

    The exact same people would persecute Jesus and think they were doing God a favour.

    Some here have been deleted and will be banned.

    -Andrew

  29. Averyl Jun 27th 2013

    Andrew, – We know you believe in Revival.

    2 questions for you:

    1) Reformation, – What do you think of the New Apostolic Reformation?

    2) – If even the very elect are in danger of being deceived by the miracles of satan, bearing in mind that we certainly don’t want to blaspheme the Holy Spirit by judging incorrectly, how are we meant to respond to any miracles? How can we know if they are performed by God or are satanic counterfeits?

  30. Andrew Jun 27th 2013

    Because I have known this guy personally – and what he preaches – for 5 or 6 years. I have stayed in his home and spent time with his family. I know his writings and his preaching.

    He has nothing to do with the NAR

    Bless you!

    Andrew Strom

  31. Averyl, it is by their fruit we know . The fruit of the Spirit that is working through a person.

    For example this Guy wasn’t promoting himself and putting on a great show, he was quite understated , and he was going strait for the spirits that were causing the afflictions.

    People can’t receive the truth when they are bound with an afflicting spirit .

  32. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    The Lord has used the natural things of this earth to explain the invisible spiritual things of His Kingdom.

    One of those examples is the agricultural seasons.

    There is a time of plowing the soil of the heart; a time of planting the seed into the soil of the heart; a time of watering the seed in the soil; and a time of harvest.

    Every individual goes through these seasons in their lifetime…..over and over and over. (The Kingdom of God, as a whole, also goes through these seasons)

    Unless we are sensitive to the Holy Spirit’s instructions, we do not know what season a person is in and what spiritual needs have to be met in order for them to be regenerated by the Holy Spirit.
    ONLY THE HOLY SPIRIT KNOWS A MAN’S HEART.

    Churchianity has put God into such a small box, that the only way anyone can be born again THESE DAYS, is by the BILLY GRAHAM CONFERENCE FORMULA.

  33. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    Averyl…. the Holy Spirit lives inside of you….ask HIM…He knows ALL THINGS.
    That’s why He was sent to live inside of you….to teach you ALL THINGS.

  34. Lightning Storm Jun 27th 2013

    A person has been healed in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

    How can that bring glory to Satan? if it was a counterfeit.

  35. Andrew Jun 27th 2013

    Well said, LS.

    It absolutely blows my mind that people would oppose this.

    The very spirit of the Pharisees, in my view

    Terrible

  36. Hi, Andrew,

    What are your thoughts on The Pioneer School he is doing? Is this brand new?

  37. Andrew Jun 27th 2013

    I am sure it will be great.

    -Andrew

  38. Averyl

    To You, who are the “elect”? I perceive you think “they” are us the Church, but I disagree. My understanding is that the “elect” in the context of Matt 24, are Israel.

    Blessings.

  39. Thank you, Andrew!

  40. Marilyn Crow Jun 28th 2013

    It`s always wonderful to see the Lord heal people. And it is good to hear that you know Torben, Andrew. He seems a sincere, humble man with a great God given desire to encourage believers to pray for others in regards to healing & deliverance.

    Now just a few words of feed back to Torben & others.

    1.THOSE NOT HEALED. We needed to see those who did not get healed (for whatever reason – even the Lord did not heal because of hard hearts) otherwise people can just assume that God will heal everyone they pray for.

    2.BE WISE LOCALLY. Torben went in & out of big cities, he didn`t know the people & wouldn`t see them again – those healed & not healed. But for most people we live in local communities, towns, suburbs where people know us or of us.

    To just go into the local supermarket & pray for people will only make people think you are a `nut, ` `strange,` `weird,` & we can lose our witness etc.

    However as the Lord leads of course we pray for each other, & then as we develop maturity to follow the Lord`s leading we pray for outsiders as well.

    Thus on God`s side it is wonderful to see healings, but on man`s side we need to be careful how we present what God is saying & not become unbalanced. This goes for all our God given giftings, talents & desires, as many of us realise.

    So just some feed back as I`m sure Torben would not desire for people to get an unbalanced view.

    Marilyn.

  41. I’m sickened by the ones who are so critical.

    Like the girl will completely lose her foul language just because she was just healed?

    Everyone doesn’t lose all their sins at once. In fact, none of us lose our sins all at once.

    It’s a process.

    I see the video as precious.

    Anyone who loves the lost will see it that way too.

    Any other thinking is just haughty and prideful – just like the Pharisees – as if you’re better.

  42. And by the way, did you come to the cross already clean?

    No – none of us did.

    And Christ deals with each of us differently.

    He is so gracious to hunt us down no matter where we are – That’s how much He loves each one of us.

    No matter how many tatoos we have – no matter how bad our language or how many people we have killed.

  43. David Marsh Jun 28th 2013

    Torben,
    You are absolutely correct.
    God is in the business of raising up again the N.T. church (or ekklesia) in its exact likeness of the 1st Century Book of Acts church. The Holy Spirit outpouring is coming, and only the N.T. ekklesia will be able to fully receive Him ( the Holy Spirit)

    God had me research the ekklesia in 2003 and I have published in a book what He has shown me on how the N.T. ekklesia works.
    You are most welcome to a free pdf copy ( or anyone else if you like)
    email me at [email protected] and I will be happy to send you a copy.

    God bless you and keep on walking with Him.

    David Marsh – Australia

    P.S. would love to talk with you.

  44. And by the way, did you come to the cross already clean?

    No – none of us did.

    And Christ deals with each of us differently.

    He is so gracious to hunt us down no matter where we are – That’s how much He loves each one of us.

    No matter how many tatoos we have – no matter how bad our language or how many people we have killed.

    Amen Sally, preach it sister… :-)

    Beautiful Jesus, You came to seek and to save that which was lost…

    Love You Lord… :-)

    Love you sister, Be blessed…

    Andrew

  45. jda016 Jun 28th 2013

    I love to see people healed and God displaying his power! I keep hoping and praying that it will be so in my life as well.

    It is really difficult to see suffering family members and pray diligently for them and not see them get better. I have had this happen all too often. The easiest answer is that I don’t have enough faith or there is unbelief or doubt in my heart or the heart of the one I pray for. And yet I see so many suffering saints who have such beautiful hearts and they still endure and tarry for their healing.

    My question is, Does God allow sickness to sometimes stay besides reasons of doubt and unbelief? Does He let sickness stay sometimes in order to perfect a person’s character or does God just desire all to be healed?

    If God does allow sickness, (I think of Job) then how do we know when God wants to heal and when He says “My grace is sufficient.” I mean I know the Holy Spirit can tell us, but I am just a little confused on the whole subject.

    But I have always believed in healing, miracles, and deliverance and I have seen it happen in my life.

  46. David Marsh Jun 28th 2013

    Brothers and Sisters,
    I am amazed at how some here are able to tell God how He should and shouldnt work with one of His servants.
    And how quickly some run to the edge of the cliff to blaspheme the Holy Spirit, as did the Pharisees who claimed that Jesus miracles were the works of the devil.

    I implore the nay sayers to exercise extreme caution and ask God to discern for them the truth of the matter.

    If you cannot tell between the true and the false servants of God, then you are indeed in great danger.

    Torben is true to God and is following Him in what He sees Him do.
    That is – what it is to be Christ like.

    God bless you all

    David Marsh.

  47. Jda016,
    wrote: If God does allow sickness, (I think of Job) then how do we know when God wants to heal and when He says “My grace is sufficient.” I mean I know the Holy Spirit can tell us, but I am just a little confused on the whole subject.

    quote………………..

    Jda,
    Do you have the Baptism of the Holy Spirit with the evidence of tongues? I assume you do.

    The greatest miracle to begin with is your born again experience, then receiving the Baptism.

    If anything it sounds like the way you were taught the Word of God while a young christian, which can influence your thinking. I know its easy to give pat answers but I know from experience that Jesus is my healer and deliverer.

    I see God working in my life daily and I am only sharing this because I know its true from personal experience.

    Its not easy sharing from one comment here, but I would highly recommend you go back through all the gospels and prayerfully ask Jesus to open you eyes to what He says and not what you have been taught.

    I know some have distorted the faith message as in the wof movement. But if you look at what Jesus said on this subject you will find it is “one of the keys” to divine healing.

    I hope you can understand this without taking any sort of offense. It is real, but I think many times people have explained it away because it did not work for them, or they have their eyes on what happens to other people.

    God does want to manifest Himself to each of us if were willing to seek Him. I am not saying you have not been doing this but again I think wrong teaching in our minds can hinder the Work of God.

    GaryB

  48. fabakary Jun 28th 2013

    To be interested only in the spiritual lives of people is not the nature or Character of God’s Love. If God
    Was only interested in the spiritual lives of people , the rain, the air, the sun will cease to be by Now. God is interested in People and people have not only spirit, they have also both soul and bodies.
    If we are only interested in the spiritual lives of people we can’t work in Gods Love ; for even if God perish by now. If God love is in us we will not only be interested in the spiritual lives of people but also their physical needs. “if a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food , and you say to them “depart in peace be warmed and filled “ but do not give them the things which are NEEDED FOR THE BODY , what does it profit (James2v15-16)”. So the Love of God extends to the need of the Body which includes health. Love is not selfless, God does not Love or heal the sick just because he want them to be Christian or born again but He heals them because of Love, and even if they will not accept Him that does not stop him in giving Love.
    God delivers me from this wrong selfish mindset in the past. It happens when I was sharing with a friend the things of Christ. He was tying a “juju” which is a traditional way many people use as a means of protection, but there is an evil spirit attach to it. I told him to remove it but he refused . Then he later ask me to pray for him because he was going though depression. I told him I will not pray for him until he repents and untie the juju, because I believed it was wrong to pray for those who neglect God. Then he departed . It was afternoon but I went to relax on my bed. I was half asleep, but the lord gave me this scripture in the dream “freely you have receive freely give “. As I woke a divine understand was open to me about God love. I went to look for the friend. I told him I will love to pray for him. Amazinly he told me “as you were sharing with me the gospel I felt something left my body and that was how I was deliver”. I was more amaze and God taught me a great lesson in that. Because God knew my tradition contradict his love , he heal the boy directly without my consent. God is love

  49. Marilyn
    Good point.

    I think also of Jesus when He went to His hometown, He was not able to do many works.

    Matthew 13:58
    And he did not many mighty works there because of their unbelief.

    GaryB

  50. Jda016 Jun 28th 2013

    Dear Gary,

    I take no offense at your comment, rather I appreciate your willingness to respond. I have received the Holy Spirit and the baptism of tongues. On a few occasions I have laid hands on the sick, prayed in Jesus name, and seen them healed. I have also laid hands on the sick and saw them remain the same. Most times when someone is not healed I am condemned for not having enough faith.

    I pray earnestly for God’s power to see the sick healed and the demonized delivered. But Inalso wonder about God’s timing. Many people who were healed by Jesus had their sicknesses for many many years. Jesus then healed them and said it was for the glory of God. It makes me think that God allowed the. To be sick for a time before their healing.

    I also think of Jesus’ words that some things only come out with prayer and fasting, which shows there is more to be done before healing comes, so some people tarry in that sickness.

    I think of the thousands of Christians that wrote to David Wilkerson and others and talked about how afflictions beset them on every side and yet they still loved God.

    I think of Joni Ericsson Tada and the joy she has before God despite being paraplegic. Is she suppose to be healed or has God allowed this so his glory might be shown through her?

    I think of Reese Howells who nearly died of turbeculois ( I think it was him with that disease) and he struggled with it for a long time before God healed him.

    I think of Paul who begged God to be delievered, only to be told that God’s grace was sufficient.

    I think of Israel that God allowed to be slaves for 400 years before delivering them.

    I think of me, as an 18 year old kid, who believed with all his heart that a family friend was going to be healed of brain cancer. I went their home, knew their kids, proclaimed it to all that God was going to heal her. A stranger walked up to this friend at Walmart and told her she was going to be healed. Churches came and prayed for her and dozens of people believed. She died. She lived 2 years longer than the doctors gave her and she always talked with me for comfort and encouragement, but God still let her die despite so many believing and praying for her healing.

    I know the scriptures of the gospels of God’s authority to heal and save and deliever. I believe them all and I have seen then work. But sometimes I feel like God says, “my grace is sufficient in this present trial and sickness because he works a greater depth of character, love and integrity in a person’s heart. I believe sometimes these sickness have a season.

    Please hear my heart in this. I am not trying to spread doubt or disbelief, but there are many questions. Sometimes I think people want to quickly pray and when the person doesn’t get healed they say, “well you just don’t have the faith” and they feel justified to walk away, rather than tarry in prayer.

    Even Elijah had to pray 7 times before he saw the rain clouds coming (I believe that is accurate).

    I love watching this video and it gives me great hope and joy, it truly does, but please understand my heart in this.

    God grant us mercy and grace to walk in all the miracles of the new testament apostles and may he remove all doubt and unbelief, but may He also give wisdom as to why he sometimes just doesnt seem to heal.

    Jonathan

  51. Lightning Storm Jun 28th 2013

    Excellent post…. Jda016

    This is an example of why we must not MAKE DECISIONS without the INSTRUCTIONS OF THE HOLY SPIRIT WITHIN US.

    If we go around laying hands on EVERYBODY to heal them or cast out demons, WE ARE NOT OPERATING IN THE WILL OF GOD FOR SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE, maybe even NONE OF THOSE PEOPLE.

    We cannot base our actions on ONE SCRIPTURE…..we must be RULED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT so that we come into ALIGNMENT WITH HIS PLAN FOR EVERY PERSON WHO ENTERS OUR LIVES……

    Your were right about TIMING. The Holy Spirit KNOWS the TIMING AND THE NEED of every person we come into contact with.

    And of course, the SPIRITUAL NEEDS ARE THE PRIORITY…..but the Holy Spirit knows how to and when to meet those needs.

    People tend to say “I want to be in the Lords will” “Your will be done, Lord”, then they look in the bible and THEY DECIDE what the Lord’s will is in this situation and person, therefore making it THEIR WILL….NOT THE LORD’S.

    We must LAY DOWN OUR WILL….surrender…..and come into ALIGNMENT with the plans of God that have been laid out before creation came into existence.
    We participate with Him. Not asking Him to participate with us.

  52. Jonathan,

    Further to what LS has posted above , when we are directed specifically by the Holy Spirit , to pray in the area of healing , it takes place .

    In the bible nothing was by chance . The Holy Spirit directed the where when and who of the early servants of Christ. This is what it is to be in His will.

    I have seen similar situations that you describe , and in the end it doesn’t glorify Christ , rather it creates doubt and uncertainty , and as you say often those who pray out of the will of Christ , then say that the person needing help lacks faith when nothing happens.

    Sickness can come from the curses of the OT see Deut , it can come from spiritual afflictions , or from wrong attitudes, unconfessed sin , or a combination of the above .

    The old foe loves to create confusion as to what is going on for example , having us praying against him , when we need to asking for blood line curses to be broken .

    So unless we are directed by the Holy Spirit , we are just guessing at what is going on, and will see many who have claimed they will be healed , lose their battle , and as I said above this does not bring glory to Jesus.

  53. DonaldN Jun 28th 2013

    Andrew– I have read your posts that blast those who oppose the video, even to deleting some of them. I will not judge this video at all, but I would advise you to see through to the hearts of those who oppose it. Many in this day have been exposed to so many false signs and lying wonders and abundance of nonsense going on in Christendom today. Perhaps an explanation in love would prove to be more helpful than condemnation. If one were to see this video without any comments from a trusted source, then it could easily be placed in the same category as Todd Bently. We do need to see the power of Jesus. We do need to see people truly saved, healed and delivered. Explain to the skeptic how you know this man and the works he is doing in the name of Jesus.

  54. Andrew Jun 28th 2013

    I have stayed and ministered alongside Torben – known him for 6 years. Here is something he wrote that will tell you a lot-

    http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/136882149?access_key=key-2nmdfpdbygt6ly7lhobh

    Bless you!

    Andrew

  55. Marilyn Crow Jun 28th 2013

    Jonathan.

    I appreciated your comments especially –
    `…may He also give wisdom as to why He sometimes just doesn`t seem to heal.`

    From my own personal experience I have been healed of certain things but in one area I have not. In the `80`s I got Ross River Fever which affects the nerves, muscles etc & I ended up with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome.

    Previously I was a teacher, played sport, flew areoplanes, gliders, played the piano at church meetings, taught Sunday school etc etc. I was busy!!!!!! Also went to Bible School in New Zealand. But after contracting CFS I was incapacitated. I prayed, others prayed but I was laid low for many years.

    But amazingly I would not change the path for I sought God in a greater way & learnt to appreciate being quiet, slow. Even married a man I would not have previously, as he was quiet.
    The wisdom I learned, Jonathan, & I know you`ll agree, is that God`s first agenda regarding us is that we become like Christ. This is what I see Him working out in me even amid sickness.

    We are all damaged, we are all `sick,` to some degree, we are all going to die, (unless `called- up to glory when He comes). I appreciate His tender kindness towards me to take me through this damaged world with damage in my body but knowing that my inner self is growing more & more like Christ as the very difficulties have pressed me closer & closer into Him. What glory, what a Saviour, what a healer, what a future.

    Marilyn.

  56. Marilyn Crow Jun 28th 2013

    Thank you Gary B.

  57. DonaldN Jun 28th 2013

    That link goes to an unreadable page. This page is on Torben’s website.
    http://www.thelastreformation.com/thelastreformation.html

  58. Hi all, up until now I have never commented on any of these topic forums.I have personally travelled in joint ministry with Andrew having known him well as a close friend for over twenty years.
    The anti healing ministry sentiments shared here by some are appalling.
    Yes there have been problems caused by false teachers around this subject that Andrew, myself and others have been quick to point out at personal cost.
    What needs to be recognised is that there are genuine healings from the Lord and satan has gone to great lengths to try sway people from a true healing ministry.
    I personally move in the healing and deliverence ministry and believe from what I have seen in videos of Torbans ministry that it is authentic.
    God bless you Torban, keep up the good work of our Lord.

    Love to you all in Christ.

    Grant

  59. Jonathan,

    Thanks for responding I have to agree with what you shared here. There are some times we just do not have the answers but we must continue to hope in the Lord.

    I wonder at this time why God has withheld His power for a season. We that have the Baptism have an anointing from God and in His word it says go pray for the sick and deliver the captives in my Name.

    But as many know the power of God is only manifested in certain areas at certain times. Its not wide spread like in the book of Acts.

    Anyway I thought what you shared was good.

    Revival is what we need at this hour and I believe the Lord is going to have a great outpouring in our life time. All things will be set in order according to His Will and purpose in the earth.

    GaryB

  60. Marilyn Crow Jun 29th 2013

    I just listened to Torben`s video on the Gospel – `Coffee & cookies.` It was excellent & I will use his illustration when I speak to people. He is a Evangelist sharing with us how to reach others in a very natural, every day setting.

    Marilyn.

  61. Amen! This just agrees with my heart. I watched the video and my first thought was, “as long as Jesus Christ is the author and is given the glory” and, praise God, so He was. I think pastor Sondergaard is a true disciple and I believe we are in the last days where we are given one more chance to harvest souls.

    I love how people in every country react exactly alike. We are all His children, and we have to admit, no matter what part of the world we come from, whether we abound or are abased, rich and poor, we all need our Saviour.

    My disappointment in how the Church is so ineffective today has been turned into joy, now that I see that there are miracles and that people in the streets are so spontaneous in accepting prayer and automatically have faith and want to believe in Jesus. Our societies just don’t talk about Him, and this young man is just on fire for Him and has absolutelly overcome his inhibitions in public and wants to speak about Jesus to everyone. I pray I had that kind of nerve and freedom. Thank the Lord we are seeing this and hopefully more will follow suit. This really is encouraging.

  62. anne thomson Jun 29th 2013

    This young man is not like Todd Bently in any way, he is not taking glory for himself and is giving it all to God.he shares the gospel with them There is a humility about him and what joy in the faces of those people he has prayed for.
    Taking Gods healing to people is one way of showing His love to them, just as if someone had lost their home and we help them with provisions and meals, you are showing Gods love. Not everyone will respond by becoming part of the Kingdom, but they will have been ministered to. This ministry to them may be a seed planting or a watering time for them
    It seems as if some correspondents on here don’t want others to be healed or saved, I get the feeling they would be sitting knitting at the gates of Hell watching people thrown into the furnace. Where is their heart of compassion for the lost.
    This young man is doing exactly what Jesus commanded and it is a joy to see. God bless Him

  63. Well, I’m reading comments here of some who are skeptical and judge the reactions from those healed in the video.

    Having been in and out of churches, having questioned, having been skeptical and distrustful, having seen and heard odd things and possibly unbiblical manifestations, etc., I am convicted today in my walk, like the verse says, whatever things are of a good report, whatever things are pure, to think on these things. If a person is healed by Jesus, and if a person in the street has received the infilling of the Holy Spirit, they may not always respond the way we think they should respond and we shouldn’t rush to judgment that they are unrepentent.

    We are living in a time where there is no time for us to judge who is worthy of receiving the Holy Spirit or not. We are not called to ask people to fill out a questionnaire on whether they are worthy or not. There are many big City people who have only known rough language and a rough existence. This is all they know. They might be rough around the edges. But, God, who is no respecter of persons, knows their heart, and if they are filled with His Holy Spirit, no man can criticize their responses. If they respond in awe with language worthy of a salty sailor, because they know no better, God is faithful and still so awesome and forgiving that He will be gentle and patient with them. If they seek Him and His word, He will continue to correct them and convict them like He does us; and their consciences will hopefully and eventually provoke them to change their worldly ways.

    On the Day of Pentecost when Peter preached to the Jewish pilgrims on what was happening before their eyes, he quoted the prophecy of Joel. They were pricked in their heart. Maybe many of these were still manifesting outward sinful lifestyles, bad language; but the Book of Acts doesn’t concentrate on what type of sins the audience exercised, or at what level of purity they were at in order to receive the Holy Spirit; it only spoke on the fact that they willingly opened their hearts and wanted the Promise. Sometimes the Lord choses at which moment He fills a person and He, who is so pure, still fills us in our sinful vessels. The Lord is the author, and decides on when and where and why He decides to fill an individual. I’ve heard of stories of people, hungry for God, walking to crusades, and even before entering the doors, starting to speak in Tongues. Who are we to judge whether that person has adequately repented?

    I am still overjoyed at how God, who is the Everlasting Father, would stoop so low and want to share Himself with us, even in these sinful vessels. Once I was filled, I wanted to know Him more and more every day, and it took years for me to progress and change bad habits and repent. Many times I got 6 steps forward, and the week after, backstepped 4 steps backward, but after repenting, He kept me and is so faithful. Thank you Jesus!!

  64. Terry E Jun 29th 2013

    I was also surprised & puzzled to see this material on your website Andrew. My question would be – If you had viewed this video from an anonymous person would you have still believed the contents? Importantly I do believe that God heals in many ways according to His will. What I discerned in this video is no different to what I’ve experienced and seen over the past 9 years or so – falseness! I would like to witness these same people healing the blind, leprosy, crippled & ministering at major hospitals. Man has not only claimed healings in the church but also taken his sideshow on the road in a way that they worship {signs, wonders & miracles} moreso than the true full Gospel. The true power in the Cross & the life saving Word of God have been exchanged for mans fleshy desire to be famous. I also read a little of Torben’s website above & it has some close similarities to a Frank Viola set of messages in his books. 2 scriptures come to mind – even the elect will be deceived if possible & satan transforms himself into an angel of light & also performs miracles etc.

    I have close Christian brothers who have some different views to myself but after discussion I still respect & love them and I want to say that even though some of us on this website disagree with this material endorsed by Andrew we need to also see his heart for sincerity & truth and embrace him as a brother in Christ.

  65. Why don’t we see more miracles in westernized nations that are rich? I believe it’s because we as a Church, are weak and passive and inactive and depend on pastors to do the job. We are lying to ourselves and are being falsely taught by institutional church pastors that our priorities are to tithe and attend services to keep the pastors satisfied that they’re running a tight ship, which helps them to promote themselves. Our churches today have nothing to do with spreading the gospel, shepherds are shackling believers into thinking that only licensed, theologically-educated, trained, experienced pastors and elders in a church are only qualified to do all the works. I believe the central problem in the Church is the pastor. Pastor does not want to lose his control. The pastor cannot allow rogue sheep to start manifesting the gifts of the Spirit without his permission. He is afraid that the congregation will get out of control and try to usurp his authority. It’s understandable that pastors want order in churches, and while it’s true that some people become over-zealous and controlling, pastors are fearful of losing authority of their good name. They want to keep their flocks in submission. The flock becomes submissive to the point that they are afraid to admit they have spiritual gifts, as they’ll be accused of being boastful. Human beings do not get along well, and if a christian pastor can’t be at peace with himself and his flock, allowing them to be ministers and going out among men, ministering, he will turn them into twice a week church-goers, whose gifts and talents are being buried in the ground. We, as stewards with talents, are forced to bury our gifts by the very men who should be encouraging us to go out to the far corners of the earth.

    Riches and prosperity are the worst distractions to keep a disciple from doing anything. Family life, work, education, travel, entertainment is squeezing the last ounce of energy out of every U.S. christian – Satan’s ploy to keep us blinded by so many temptations. Here in Canada as well, the majority of christians are happy with burying their talents while they pursue the good life. Christianity in north America is almost non-existent, as far as discipling is concerned. And this is why we do not see miracles and signs and wonders. Until we choose to lay down the distractions and lay down the materialism and conveniences and pleasures – and until we dig out our spiritual talents out of the ground and give our total focus on using them for others, we won’t see healings, deliverances, and soul-saving. I’m preaching to myself here.

  66. All I know is that I was once lost, and now am saved, thanks to my Jesus. All I know, is that if a man, names Torben, takes the time to walk and share risks being called a fake or a fool by strangers, he still takes the risk and reaches some who may otherwise never been reached.

    All I know is that when I was saved, a good pastor was there and when I called him to ask about bible study, he came to our home every Monday night for several months and spent several hours teaching. Because of his sacrifice, my husband and I were saved.

    After reading some comments from those still questionning the integrity of Mr. Sondergaard, and I understand how we must always be discerning, I fear that we christians will never be open to revival. If those like this young man are receptive to becoming disciples like the early church, then I am going to pray for this man that God paves the way for him. It’s the least I can do. We know who are His, by how they live by example and by their fruit.

    If a pastor uses his ministry to elevate his name and wants to become a spiritual celebrity, it will be seen in plain sight soon enough. The fruit will be rotten. But, if it’s spiritual fruit, it will be humble, meek, compassionate, and will give God all the glory.

    I give anyone the benefit of the doubt who loves Jesus and is willing to teach us, the church, how wrong we’ve been doing church. If not Torden, then who? If God sends us prophets, will we persecute them? We have trusted in walls and buildings and projects and now that Jesus is soon returning, the time is crucial for each of us to seriously ask ourselves if we shouldn’t be following suit and going out in groups in streets and by-ways and hospitals and prisons and poorhouses, and in shopping malls and Wal-Marts. We can’t place God in a box, and decide where in which place He can only be discussed.

    Am praying for you, brother Torben. May the Lord bless you and keep you strong and able to fend off all the carnal temptations that will be thrown at you. Amen.

  67. fabakary Jun 29th 2013

    One thing about the life our Lord Jesus Christ concerning in His healing of the sick, He did not heal everybody in his earthly ministry. But the amazing fact is HE HEALED EVERMAN THAT ASKED OF HIM. Some were healed not because they asked but because of God purpose; as He was led by the Spirit. This were specifically Chosen to be healed for the Glory of God, so no matter what they will be healed. Yet as for the many others , as many as meet him and ask of Him , HE HEALED THEM ALL. So many were not healed simply because THEY DID NOT ASK. One thing the lord help me understand about the work of the believer when it comes in praying for the sick is something like “it is not for you to go about here and there in searching for the sick ,without being led of my spirit, but pray for any that asked of you as you go on your daily activities “. So like Jesus we are to be led by the spirit on where to go when it comes in praying for the sick but when we meet the sick who ask of us , in our daily activities we are to pray for them . For example there is a case of a close friend of mine studying medicine at a university in my country. One of his school mate a medical student who is a Muslim was suffering from a terrible sickness yearly which cost him to spend more years than require in the school . Doctors couldn’t help it. One day this Muslim student went to my friend and told “please pray for me I believe if you pray for me I will be healed “. Yet my friend did not prayed for him because he said He was not sure if it was God will for him to pray for Him since he did not hear any specific word from God. When he came to our house and told me about it , I convince Him it is always God will for us to pray for those who ask for our prayers. He went and pray for the student and he received His healing and up to date I don’t hear him with that sickness and he is doing the course. Ignorance from a believer will have prevented this miracle from happening. Nothing limit the believer nothing than the ignorance of his right , duty and responsibility like the ignorance of the many who did not received their healing from Jesus because they did not ask.

  68. It is interesting to read the last words of our Lord before he was recieved up into heaven ….

    Mark 16:15-18
    “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature.
    He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.
    And these signs will follow those who believe: In my name they will cast out demons ; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up serpents ; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them ; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

    Jesus has clearly stated the signs that follow a believer.
    How does one become a believer ….By grace you are saved through faith and that faith having come by hearing the word of the Lord and the Bible teaches “who can hear unless there is a preacher.”

    Much of what Tobin is doing is normal grass roots new testament christainity in action, by that I mean ministry that is availiable to, from and by any believer in the Lord as stated by Jesus in Mark 16 above.

    The sad part is that so many christians have never realised the truth of all that God wishes to do through them in this world, people are perishing due to our lack of knowledge in God.

    There will be those who go before the Lord at the time of judgement claiming before the Lord that they healed in His name and He says get away from Me I never knew you.
    And there will be those of us who know Him ….I hope we have done more.

    God bless,

    Grant

  69. Jonathan,

    I know everyone quotes poor old Job at least that is the way it comes across. But lets remember that Job was blessed more in his latter days.

    42:12 Now the Lord blessed the latter days of Job more than his beginning;

    When the disciples were afraid because of the storm, Jesus rebuked them for lack of faith.

    When the disciples could not cast the demon out of the child Jesus rebuked them for lack of faith, but he goes on to say this type comes out by prayer and fasting.

    When the disciples tried to quiet the blind men Jesus called them to Him and healed them.

    The problem is never with the Lord its with “us” His disciples. Jesus laid aside His Divine attributes and functioned in the Spirit in His humanity.

    He is our example and this is why I shared its important to look to what Jesus said in the gospels.

    If we look at men and all their different circumstances we will not see the answers, its only through Christ and what He did on the cross and looking to Him as the author and finisher of our faith.

    When we see examples in leadership like Wigglesworth, or others, we see people consumed with the presence of the Lord who pressed in despite the odds.

    God is no respecter of persons and I think in this hour to make the difference we have to learn to take our eyes off of men and their circumstances and Look only to the Lord.

    I think there is a key here that is often overlooked.

    If Jesus was here today would He still be rebuking us for our lack of faith in Him in certain areas? I think He would because He is the same today as He was yesterday.

    Anyway I just wanted to share that the Lord is our example that it does work, like I said I think the problem is with “us” His disciples.

    Anyway I am a firm believer that divine healing is true and that God redeemed us from the curse of the law. And I think its important to keep looking to the Lord no matter what takes place.

    God only tested Job for a season and then blessed him in his latter end. It could be possible that some people are not passing their tests and learning what the Lord wants to show them.

    Just some more thoughts on this I wanted to share.

    I want to share a testimony, when I was first saved I did not know nothing about the Bible or the Lord. I was walking down the street the next day and I saw a blind man who always set on the street begging for money and would sing songs. He had done this for years.

    I did not have any knowledge of God but when I saw this blind man the thought came to me that God can do anything and he could heal this man. I had a cross that I carried with me and I gave it to him and told him that God was alive and loved him.

    At that time I did not understand that we could pray for people and God would heal them. I did not have the Baptism of the Spirit then, but I knew in my heart that God was God and nothing was impossible to Him.

    I think about this sometimes, Jesus still wants to set the captives free through us. He is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow.

    GaryB

  70. Lightning Storm Jun 29th 2013

    Oh wow these posts are getting better and better!

    Hallelujah, my hope is rising up…..this awakening is further along than I thought! Praise and Glory to You oh Lord.

  71. Jda016 Jun 29th 2013

    I agree that most often the lack of our ability to heal others and deliver them is because of our doubt. But I also believe, like you said Gary, that God allows things for a time.

    All of Job’s afflictions were purposed to bring him to a greater understanding of God. He was righteous, and yet he suffered. The suffering worked in Him a greater “weight of glory.” In the end God blessed him more than before, but the purpose of the suffering was so he could say, ” I have heard of You by the hearing of the ear, But now my eyes see You. Therefore I abhor myself And repent in dust and ashes” (Job 42:5-6).

    His experience of suffering, not instant healing, caused Him to know God more. Is knowing God in a deeper level not the goal of all Christians? God uses many ways to bring us to know Him better, but I believe one of those ways is suffering.

    I point this out, not because I don’t believe in healing, but because I believe that God sometimes allows suffering to have a purifying work in us.

    Paul e Bilheimer wrote in “Don’t Waste Your Sorrows” ( Chapter 6) something that I have found very important (this is one of the greatest books I have ever read that brings comfort to those who are suffering with continued affliction and sickness).

    “Until recently, during all of my lengthy ministry, I have been under the solid impression that supernatural healing and deliverance here and now always brings more glory to God and more eternal profit to the individual than continued suffering. For those who are healed this is probably true. A sovereign God knows what He is doing. But for those who are not healed, may it not be otherwise?

    The Greatest Eternal Profit
    There is something to be said for this viewpoint. If the goal of the universe is character—that is, a disposition of agape love—and if character cannot be created without tribulation, then may not the discipline of tribulation produce in both time and eternity as desirable a result, if not “a better one? The answer lies in our reaction to the discipline. Resentment and rebellion only waste one’s sorrows, whereas humble acceptance and brokenness allow the creation of an “eternal weight of glory.”

    Excerpt From: Paul E. Billheimer. “Don’t Waste Your Sorrows.” CLC. iBooks.
    This material may be protected by copyright.

    He goes on to say that the greatest saints of the past are the ones who suffered the most. He points to Hebrews 11 and says,

    ““From verse 32 through the first part of verse 35 is the record of the heroes of faith who were gloriously, miraculously and supernaturally delivered. There is nothing like it outside the annals of sacred history. Among other spectacular deliverances recorded, such as those of Daniel from the lion’s den and the three Hebrew children from the fiery furnace, mention is made of supernatural healing when “weakness was turned to strength” (11:34, NIV), and others were raised from the dead (11:35).

    But another order of heroes of faith is listed beginning in the middle of verse “35:

    Others were tortured, not accepting deliverance; that they might obtain a better resurrection: and others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment: they were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented. (11:35–37)
    According to verse 39, these also “were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised” (NIV).”

    Is not the Christian who suffers so sweetly for the sake of the cross to be commended for their faith, rather than condemned for their doubt or unbelief? Again I think of Madam Guyon, Joni Ericson Tada, Watchmen Née, even Wigglesworth suffered with kidney stones so bad that he would be bleeding even while preaching.

    My only point is to say that I believe God allows suffering to work in us a greater weight of glory and bring us closer to depend more and more upon Him. This never makes me stop praying for healing or deliverance though.

    Does this make any sense to anyone? If anyone feels differently I am happy to hear them.

  72. Jda016 Jun 29th 2013

    I believe the great commission and I believe we are always to pray for those who are sick and afflicted as God leads us, but I also wonder if some people like Torben have the gift of healing. What I mean is that some people are much more capable to walk in certain things than others.

    As I have said, I have laid my hands on the sick and seen them healed, but never to the degree like Torben.

    My mother has the incredible gift of discernment and sometimes God reveals a person’s heart or the Presence if an evil spirit to her instantly when she only just meets them. I believe discernment is available to all, just like healing is, but some people seem to have a larger gifting in certain things than others.

    Scripture makes it clear that it is available to all Spirit filled Christians and yet some are chosen to walk in a greater levels of gifting.

    Does this make sense?

  73. Marilyn Crow Jun 29th 2013

    Jda016

    Jonathan, your comments blessed me & I agree with what you have said. A difficult subject especially with so much pain & suffering in this damaged world. But we know that the cruel cross on which our saviour died shows us that He knows, He understands, & then, praise Him, resurrection is on the other side.

    Marilyn

  74. Marilyn Crow Jun 29th 2013

    This is a poem I learnt from my Scottish mother.

    `Not till the loom is silent & the shuttle cease to fly,
    Will God unfold His wisdom & explain the reason why,
    The dark threads are as needful in the weaver`s skilful hands,
    As the threads of gold & silver, in the pattern He has planned.`

    Marilyn.

  75. fabakary Jun 30th 2013

    .SJDO16 what I understand is every Faith must be tested. If God reveals a revelation, be preparing because it will be tested to the core. But it is the enemy that tries our faith, God does not tempt any. Job in the old testament had no revelation of the name of Jesus , so all that he could do is to trust in God for the purity of his soul. He had a revelation of “purity” but not the revelation of the name of Jesus over the works of darkness. God still permit many works of the enemy today but in our case He has given us the name of Jesus over those works. If we did not use the name in faith and persistence because of ignorance the enemy will overcome us, physically though we can still keep our “purity”.
    There was a time a go God was speaking to me in a dream about a certain brother in Christ with one of the most outstanding gift of healing in Africa. When God speak to me in a dream, personally I do not like interpreting them literally, but with other means if it is literal you just know it. The lord through various dreams was showing me how in the past this minister faith about healing was tested to the core by the enemy attacking his Children but the lord shows me how the man was persistence , in His faith over the works of the enemy. The dream was repeating over and over but because it was a dream I was not taking it literally and secondly the way the man use to talk about God will for healing , it was too much for me to believe the man ever pass though this testing. It was one day a friend visited me and we were talking about “the trials of the faith” and he made mention of this brother in Christ , how he had the man speaking in a cassette about how the enemy attach his kids I think it was with dumbness and everyday he have to rise and rebuke the spirit of dumbness with faint persistence until they received healing. The saddest part of it was I taught the lord gave me that information just for me to have a knowledge of what happen to that brother not knowing I was about to pass through similar things. Just some months after this revelation, the enemy stated attacking my father house because I did not have a wife or kids . The attack was so much that I will have get discouraged and get bitter to God Like Job thinking it is God not knowing it is the enemy. For the first time in my life, is either this sister or that sisister is seriously sick , after that comes my mother and this are dangerous sickness. I think two are at present on life medication, one was healed by prayers. At present my Dad who is not yet old just about 55 yrs is admitted to the hospital with a very terrible sickness and will spend nothing less than two months according to doctors on hospital bed. I will have forsaken God, and will not be here on this forum reading about the things of Christ because I will not worship a God that destroy the innocent. Apart from one of the sickness by one of my sister all the others came simultaneously after that dreams about the works of the enemy. I will not give up , but will keep worshiping the God of all goodness, power and mercy. As for the sicknesses I will still keep the prayer of faith, with the expectation of victory in the end.

  76. Jda016 Jun 30th 2013

    Marilyn, that is a beautiful poem!

    Fabakary, I agree with you that we should always continue to ask God for healing and press into prayer. I just didn’t want anyone to get discouraged because their of their sickness or the sickness of a loved one, that just didn’t seem to want to go away.

  77. fabakary Jun 30th 2013

    I understand JD016 , yes we should not be discouraged but we should be aware it is the enemy not God.

  78. Hi Jda016,

    Yes some are gifted in such a way by the Holy Spirit that you see them consistantly moveing it certain ministry more than the usual.
    If we look at the scripture that says “all may prophesy but not all are prophets” this shows us that any believer may give a prophetic word but their are some who have the ministry of a prophet, just as their are evangalists but then all believers are asked to preach the gospel to.

    As we start to move in faith we will mature, we need to excercise our trust/ faith in God and excersise the gifts just like you would build your fitness up to play sports etc You will noticeTorban coaches (Disciples) people in God , just like you see sportsman improve with good coaching.

    Yes we must be led by the Spirit of God but it seems believers want the 100% sure thing before they do anything, yet the gifts operate by faith. God says without faith it is impossible to please Him.
    Faith resides in our heart and sometimes defies explaination thats why some people say “I just know” because they can’t reason to a person how God has spoken to them they just know.

    Torben has practised acting on Gods word from the Bible and as it has been given to him by the Holy Spirit which has built up his faith.
    I believe many fear failure so do nothing at all for fear they are presumeing or will look bad or could discourage others and then miss a moment in God for another.

    This may be of help……Lots of times even when I am very certain of what the Lord has said to me I will say to the person I am about to give a word to or minister healing etc ….
    ” I could be wrong but I believe the Lord is saying…..” or ” excuse me but do you have a problem with your right knee (or what ever it is)” .
    Sometimes it just about how you approach things that takes the pressure off .
    If you are wrong people will let you know ( I have found that to be a rarety and asked a bit more to find out that it wasn’t that you were wrong but they have some other issue pre occupyng them).
    I have had some people say no, turn away and then come back and say how did I know or just having said no pause think and say yes you are right after they have gotten over the fact that someone they don’t know is talking to them.

    Remember the gifts are supernatural ,I like to think of this in this way way,that we are in the Lord “super”(more than normal) because we are born again and have the Holy Spirit but yet very natural (we don’t have to be weird).

    I personally have seen many miracles and nearly always later on when alone thinking about it burst into tears and say to myself and the Lord “what if …. hadn’t done what you said Lord” its humbleing because you know the reality that the Lord does it not any person.

    To finish off I will leave with a true story to thinkover.
    One day I was talking with a man I knew who trained ambulance drivers (he had trained both my wife and I in occupational first aid ).
    The night before he had attended to a car accident the accident victim had died because he couldn’t preform heart massage on him sucessfully due to the car dashboard being crushed up and in the way.
    He still tried to do it from behind but wasn’t sucessfull he was feeling down about not saving the man.
    I then said to the man I knew ” think about all the people you have saved”.
    Maybe on that day he was thinking about giving up driving a ambulance,
    What if he had never driven an ambulance for all those years .
    What if he had only done it a few times and given up.
    “Think about all those Jesus has and will save, heal and deliver via the hands and lips of His body, who we are part”.

    God bless you, your brother in Christ,

    Grant

  79. Andrew Jun 30th 2013

    Excellent post, Grant.

    Bless you!

    -Andrew Strom

  80. Jda016 Jun 30th 2013

    Dear Grant,

    Thank you for sharing that. I believe that is a very balanced and good way to look at things!

    God keep you,

    Jonathan

  81. Jda016 Jun 30th 2013

    Prayer for the sick has always been difficult for me, because I am, in part, a caretaker for my mom who has a whole plethora of physical ailments. She is only 60 and many of these problems she has had her whole life. One thing she has is an extreme chemical sensitivity. An antibiotic to help with a urinary tract infection can end up making her even sicker and many medications she is allergic to.

    I do remember one time she had a UTI and I prayed a very simple prayer for her and it went away. I was actually surprised because the prayer was so simple and God honored it. However, she still suffers from a great many urinary tract infections and that is just one of many things she has.

    I have prayed diligently and I praise God for the victories along the way, but the victories are not lasting victories. It can be very weary to continue in prayer, only to see sickness remain. I can only think and believe that God has some purpose in it and even my mother has told me that many of the afflictions she has gone through has allowed Christ-like character to develop in her.

    I do however have a growing unction or thinking that God has more than just suffering for her. I confess my unbelief and doubt because I want to have the faith that would see her well because I love her deeply. I hate to see her suffer and I feel so helpless, because I can not make her well.

    I believe in her healing, but it always seems like a far off thing that will happen “someday” just never Today. I want the faith for Today; That this very day she would be made well from all her infirmities. Oh Jesus help me and deliver her!

    I do yearn for so much more. I yearn to walk deeper in the power and grace of God. I yearn to see the sick made whole. Oh Jesus help my unbelief!

  82. I will support your faith for healing – for the gift of healing – to be given you Jonathan so that you can see the dead raised, the demon possessed released and the sick healed…

    As per your desire so it will be…

    God plants the desire and allows the desire to mature into reality…

    Be encouraged, God has planted the desire in you so He will give you the desire of your heart – for this is His desire planted in you… :-)

    Love you brother,

    Andrew

  83. Marilyn Crow Jul 1st 2013

    Jdo016

    Jonathan, what a precious son you are to your mother. What has helped me in my journey with CFS & having to be in bed a lot is for my husband to pray for me. What this does is strengthens my spirit, my inner person to go through the trials & sufferings.

    I know it can be very difficult for the carer to see the person they love in difficulties. Last year I was carer for my husband for a change as he had a bulging disc & it wasn`t diagnosed properly. I had to take him to the doctors lying in the back of the car in pain. We live out of town so it took a while. He would lie in bed & eat kneeling down by the bed. Eventually I called an ambulance as he was in so much pain.

    I prayed everyday for him & he came through it. He is much more careful of the farm work he does now. And on my side I manage my strength that I am given. And the prayers whether immediate healing or strength to go through is never wasted as I`m sure you know. The bonds of deep care & compassion for others is only produced as we all go through these difficult times.

    Pray on dear brother…….God is with you both. Marilyn.

  84. David Marsh Jul 1st 2013

    Having spent 21 years as a Christian, researching, analysing, studying, discerning and testing what is and what isnt of God with over 15 years of looking into the Smith Wigglesworth’s of the 20th Century. And having witnessed first hand 2 great men of God viz Lester Sumrall (1993) and Stuart Gramenz who both walked hand in hand with God the Holy Spirit – it wasnt too difficult to recognise the real thing when I studied intently Torben Sondergaard’s video displayed above.

    And having just read his book ‘The Sound Doctrine’ there is no doubt that Torben has just begun to walk after God in the same manner as Smith Wigglesworth.

    I am not suggesting for a moment that Torben wants to elevated above anyone else – because I am sure that he does not – but I have to say that he is an end time leader (among men) in the way that he is leading by example.

    When Mr Sumrall visited our church in 1993 the meeting literally vibrated with the Holy Spirit. Mr Sumrall was unlike any other speaker that I had seen. Observing him intently, he seemed not to know what he was going to do next, as though he was constantly waiting for instruction, an instruction that when he received he immediately obeyed – because he knew that this was his true role under God. God’s supernatural was tangible and I do not need to go into those specifics but Lester was just as surprised by what God was doing as were the rest of us. We saw a servant of God waiting upon God – and we saw God move.

    Stuart Gramenz is another amazing man of God, exhibiting the same servant hood, constantly looking for what God wants him to do – and there are many testimonies of what God has done through this servant.

    May God bless you abundantly Torben,

    We need many more men like you,

    David Marsh

  85. Lightning Storm Jul 1st 2013

    I’m going to split this article so the post is not too long.

    Part 1

    ZADOK PUBLICATIONS MONTHLY NEWSLETTER
    July 1, 2013

    Higher Realms of Authority

    Introduction: I want to begin this month’s study by looking into a passage in 2 Kings. The biblical account shows the frustration of the King of Syria in trying to do battle with Israel, because Elisha was telling Israel the battle plans of their enemy before they were executed. In a search for a traitor among his troops, he discovers that Israel’s prophet is able to hear even his bedroom discussions and supernaturally knows his secrets. To stop the flow of this information, the Syrian monarch sent a large army to surround the city where the prophet resided. It is at this point we hear the dismay of Elisha’s servant boy in seeing the contingent of soldiers and armor on the horizon.

    2 Kings 6:15-18
    15 And when the servant of the man of God arose early and went out, there was an army, surrounding the city with horses and chariots. And his servant said to him, “Alas, my master! What shall we do?”

    16 So he answered, “Do not fear, for those who are with us are more than those who are with them.” 17 And Elisha prayed, and said, “LORD, I pray, open his eyes that he may see.” Then the LORD opened the eyes of the young man, and he saw. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha. 18 So when the Syrians came down to him, Elisha prayed to the LORD, and said, “Strike this people, I pray, with blindness.” And He struck them with blindness according to the word of Elisha.

    Aside from the beneficence of Elisha toward those sent to harm him, the point of this passage for our study is three-fold. First, there is the declaration of faith, “Do not fear, for those who are with us are more than those who are with them.” Second, is the opening of the eyes of the servant in order to see into the Spirit realm. Third, is the will of the prophet brought to pass by the Almighty.

    Most of these three elements never are considerations in our thoughts or even deemed relevant to our life situations. We don’t expect God to show up this way. We have assigned such occasions to the Old Testament or, in some cases, New Testament phenomena. We are skeptical of His power toward us and say, “Prophets may have had special treatment, but not us.” Who says? Our eyes are as dimmed as the servant boy’s. Our prayer should be, “Lord, open my eyes that I may see into the real reality.”

    The world has a force which seeks to determine “reality” and define our “circumstances.” That force is the enemy of God and has fear and unbelief oozing out of every crack. We are led to believe there is no hope for a nation, no relief from the “clear and present danger.” But God! Elisha’s servant boy had an eye opening experience that surely colored the rest of his days. Never again would he take surface situations as fact. He would look beyond and see the plan and the power of God. The lad learned to “step up into the God realm.” So, must we!

    Somehow, the church has relegated God to the human factor; He has been made in our image. His power has been challenged by science and technology. The Creator is seen as one reduced in resources and plundered by the “unexpected.” Not so!

    Lord, open our eyes!

    It is time to expect angels and voices and heavenly intervention. It is time to declare what we want to happen and, like Elisha, expect it to be done. Is this too presumptive? Is it better to rehearse what is happening according to the media or confess what we desire over the landscape of our lives?

    Elisha saw God send a great army which struck his enemies blind. But sometimes, Jehovah just sends a noise. Sometimes just a noise is enough. Let us review the passage:

    2 Kings 7:6-8
    For the LORD had caused the army of the Syrians to hear the noise of chariots and the noise of horses – the noise of a great army; so they said to one another, “Look, the king of Israel has hired against us the kings of the Hittites and the kings of the Egyptians to attack us!” 7 Therefore they arose and fled at twilight, and left the camp intact – their tents, their horses, and their donkeys – and they fled for their lives. 8 And when these lepers came to the outskirts of the camp, they went into one tent and ate and drank, and carried from it silver and gold and clothing, and went and hid them; then they came back and entered another tent, and carried some from there also, and went and hid it.
    NKJV

    Solomon wrote:

    The wicked flee when no one pursues,
    But the righteous are bold as a lion.
    Proverbs 28:1

    When the lepers reviewed the handiwork of the Lord, they were amazed and consequently the turn of events verified what the prophet had spoken. Those were the days of the super supernatural. Why not again? Our prayers and confessions should affirm our belief in the overcoming power of God to marshal heaven in our behalf, but do they?

    We must consider the higher reaches of Him who declares, “I am the most high.” How can a populous, who says they are saints, be content elsewhere when God beckons them to sit in heavenly places? When Paul wrote, “He has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places by Christ Jesus,” did He mean for us to grovel under the hand of the oppressor?
    Habakkuk declared, when all the worldly aspects of economy failed and national malfeasance had localized to his neighborhood, “He (God) will make me to walk in all my High Hills.” Let us possess our high places!

    Somebody shout!

    Come Up Higher:

    Adam and Eve conversed with the Lord God Almighty every evening.

    Enoch walked with God and got on such a high place he just stayed.

    Noah spoke with the Lord and his deliverance came.

    Abraham entertained Melchizedek and the blessing came.

    Job searched for reasons in the darkness of his oppression and wound up in a deliverance meeting with the Most High.

    Elijah stood on a mount and called for fire to come down and fire did.

    Elisha raised a lad from the dead and defied death’s grip.

    Isaiah saw the heavens open and the glory of God when King Uzziah died.

    Ezekiel saw two visions: first, the heavens opened and the creatures of God were visible. In a second vision, he saw the new Temple and the New Jerusalem.

    John, the Revelator, went into the presence of God on the Sabbath and saw things that are yet to be done.

    (continued)

  86. Lightning Storm Jul 1st 2013

    Part 2

    Tell me now; just how far is heaven from earth? Tell me how there is no answer to your problem. Explain to me why these, whose visages hang in the Hebrews 11 hall of fame, are different than you and me?

    Our hearts need to burn within us like those on the Emmaus Road –for the Lord is in our presence. The Bible says He is never far from us. He is speaking revelation and light to us and it is His initiative. We must be more open to these higher aspects of our faith than we currently display. We need to repent of selling God short, of limiting His power and determining His boundaries in our lives. It is time we experienced a refreshing renewal of just who He is!

    Paul’s Damascus Road confrontation marked him forever.

    The heavenly vision showed him how close heaven is to earth. He confesses, in 2 Corinthians 12, that the huge amount of revelation that came to him began with his understanding of that proximity. After all, when the Philippian earthquake shook down prison walls, he knew it was not his singing ability–but his confidence in the closeness of his God.

    Simon’s visit by the angel in prison and the doors that opened by themselves was a “boldness booster” for the man of faith. After all, he had already been challenged on the Sea of Galilee to think higher, walk higher, yeah to walk on water. His experiences with the Most High affected his ministry. He remembered pulling up the fish overload with straining nets and knew heaven is never far away from his need. When the sheet lowered, he was aware that revelation was taking place on his spiritual plate. Listen, how many experiences will it take for us to come into the super supernatural?

    Jesus’ miracles poured out from a mind linked with God’s power and ability. He knew He could change anything. He told us, “greater miracles will you do.” When are we going to realize we can change anything too? Paul said we have the mind of Christ. John 14 is about being linked to Jesus in the same way He is linked with God, the Father. (My prayer is for forgiveness. My prayer is a confession that I have lived beneath the level that His grace has provided.)

    Azotus events are not just for Philip. A higher level of physics was ordered for him! Did it affect his ministry or boost his ego as the first to fly-no, he knew of Elijah’s whirlwind chariot and Jesus’ departure on a cloud. God will call into effect a higher order of physics when we need it. Look at Joshua’s sun standing still. It is Him who orders this universe, not the climatologist or the EPA.

    Jacob could tell us a thing or two about the super supernatural. There is similarity between Jacob’s wrestling angel and Daniel’s angel wrestling with the dark spirits over Babylon. Both angels were on duty to man. Both angels contended for a human. Both angels knew their place was to carry out the will of God. When the Bible says in James that we have ministering angels to assist us-they may be called upon without impunity.

    Our considerations about God’s willingness to aid us must be lifted. We must learn to trust less on our reasoning and more on the closeness of heaven’s provision for us. Ravens are still available. Cruses of oil are still available. The prophet’s hand is still within reach. Loaves and fishes are still in the hands of God’s servants. Gold is still in the belly of the catch. The healing waters are near for Naaman’s need. “Rise up and walk” can still be voiced. There is still enough mud to apply to blinded eyes. The voice of many waters has not been silenced. The mulberry tree can still rustle. The shout of saints can still bring down Jericho walls! Heaven is near!

    Yes, it is true; His ways and thoughts are higher than ours, but they are not un-transferable to us. Have we not experienced those about us who understand the rich things of the Lord and enter conversation deeper than others? Is it not a delight to our inner person to convey some of the treasures that have been given to us and hear from them those things the Spirit has imparted? Well, the Lord waits for us to come up, to tread some areas hidden from most but available to His saints. He desires to bring us into His counsel and allow fellowship with those who exceed our grandest mind.

    Jeremiah 29:11-14
    11 For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the LORD, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope. 12 Then you will call upon Me and go and pray to Me, and I will listen to you. 13 And you will seek Me and find Me, when you search for Me with all your heart. 14 I will be found by you, says the LORD, and I will bring you back from your captivity; I will gather you from all the nations and from all the places where I have driven you, says the LORD, and I will bring you to the place from which I cause you to be carried away captive.

    It is time for a Holy Ghost review of the force field of Revelation. It is time for a refreshing vision found in the Song of Solomon where King Jesus comes in pillars of smoke riding on a palanquin with mighty warriors carrying Him. O, it is time to renew our faith and declare, “He is our King, and He cannot fail.”

    Psalms 47:1-48:1
    Oh, clap your hands, all you peoples!
    Shout to God with the voice of triumph!
    2 For the LORD Most High is awesome;
    He is a great King over all the earth.
    3 He will subdue the peoples under us,
    And the nations under our feet.
    4 He will choose our inheritance for us,
    The excellence of Jacob whom He loves.
    Selah

    5 God has gone up with a shout,
    The LORD with the sound of a trumpet.
    6 Sing praises to God, sing praises!
    Sing praises to our King, sing praises!
    7 For God is the King of all the earth;
    Sing praises with understanding.

    8 God reigns over the nations;
    God sits on His holy throne.
    9 The princes of the people have gathered together,
    The people of the God of Abraham.
    For the shields of the earth belong to God;
    He is greatly exalted.

    The trumpet of God never sounds “Retreat.” It is time we examined our beliefs about the One who is about to enter earth’s air on a White Horse. It is time to establish that there are no boundaries or places where His power is off limits. “I Am” is present tense! He is!

    Until Next Month,
    Dr. C. R. Oliver, PhD

  87. GaryB Jul 1st 2013

    A Testimony on Healing;

    I know a man who years ago had gangrene in his foot. The Doctor told him if you do not let me operate and cut this off it will spread in your body and you don’t have long to live.

    The man told the Doctor he was going to trust the Lord to heal his foot. Someone took pictures of his foot, it was totally black and a greenish color and the toes and toe nails were starting to rot off.

    Months later this mans foot was totally restored, with new flesh and everything looked normal. He went back to the Doctor who had a pentecostal background. The Doctor told him, this is the first time I have seen a real miracle of this nature.

    I know of a number of documented cases where people were totally healed outside of medical science.

    Divine healing is real and for today. Just woke up this morning and was thinking of all the healings I have seen and heard of and wanted to encourage anyone here.

    At the turn of the century there was a Doctor named Lillian Yeoman who left the medical profession to go into the ministry.

    She would take all of the hardest cases of people given up by medical science with uncureable diseases and would share with them the scriptures with prayer. Everyone who came to her was cured of every disease imaginable, through this ministry.

    This was in the time frame of the great healing revival. I would highly recommend her books on divine healing.

    GaryB

  88. When Mr Sumrall visited our church in 1993 the meeting literally vibrated with the Holy Spirit. Mr Sumrall was unlike any other speaker that I had seen. Observing him intently, he seemed not to know what he was going to do next, as though he was constantly waiting for instruction, an instruction that when he received he immediately obeyed – because he knew that this was his true role under God. God’s supernatural was tangible and I do not need to go into those specifics but Lester was just as surprised by what God was doing as were the rest of us. We saw a servant of God waiting upon God – and we saw God move.

    What you shared on Lester Sumrall was awesome David, It really encouraged me and reminded me of Smith Wigglesworth’s prophecy… :-)

    Awesome, Praise You Jesus… :-)

    Thanks brother,

    Andrew

  89. David Marsh Jul 2nd 2013

    Andrew Horton,
    Thank you so much for your kind words of encouragement. I am saddened and have felt discouraged that so many brothers and sisters are so fearful and averse to the beautiful person of the Holy Spirit. As though He is an historical myth who only came to the fore during the times of when the bible was written.

    He is alive and He is present right now and He is more real and more wise and more powerful than we could ever imagine.

    The nay sayers seem to held in the grip of fear and doubt of clinging to the teachings of priests and reverends that He is not the same TODAY – as he was back in biblical times.
    Oh how the Lord must grieve. I pray that He would open their eyes and hearts to Him.

    God bless you all,

    David Marsh.

  90. He is alive and He is present right now and He is more real and more wise and more powerful than we could ever imagine.

    Amen brother, and we will experience Him more and more and more in what is coming… :-)

    Praise You Jesus… :-)

    I prophesy that over you David that you personally will experience Him (the Holy Spirit) more and more and more flowing through you and your ministry to Him (Father, Son & Holy Spirit – the Lord) as He releases it in you, the Power of the Holy Spirit released in you – I feel the birth pangs – I am birthing something in you brother as I pray this – there is a birthing in you that you will experience what you have so righteously desired (I see your righteous desire for His Glory – the Glory of His Presence through His Holy Spirit expressed and exhibited in our midst – the Awe of His Presence – His Power and His Provision) – what you have so righteously desired you will receive – you will receive – it will break upon your head brother – I see this – receive it in the Name of Jesus – He will use you brother – you – you are willing so He will use you (Praise You Jesus – bless my brother)… :-)

    Love you,

    Andrew

  91. David Marsh Jul 2nd 2013

    Andrew and all,
    To those who want to draw closer to Him as Torben has demonstrated for us.
    In ‘The Sound Doctrine’ Torben relates in the preface a little about himself and there are many parallels between him and the likes of Wigglesworth and John G Lake that are worth taking note of.
    Torben is a man who is truly sold out to God. Upon conversion he has thrown himself into every activity that most are familiar with to spread the good word of Jesus. Church, house church leadership, praying for the sick and street evangelising.
    But he became so dissatisfied with the very little ‘fruit’ that was produced from all this activity. He said to God after reading the parable about the tree bearing no fruit,- dig around it and give it one more year – give me one more year to produce fruit or else let me die.

    He decided then to fast for 40 days and studied the Word of God with prayer.

    The result was that God then began to move in a much more powerful way with over 150 genuine healings in one year with many other things that God began to do in his life.
    It was like reading about Wigglesworth, only Torben is young and alive and active today. What an inspiration.

    God had Torben write a book on the churches need for Holiness and it can be accessed on the net. It is a must read, and God points out that until the church cleans itself, He cannot begin to move with her.
    This reminds me of Tommy Hicks vision of the ‘bride of Christ’ represented by the giant on earth beginning to clean the debris off itself before it could move.

    As well as Holiness, Torben significantly fasted and continues to fast on a regular basis. I am convinced more than ever now of the necessity of fasting to access the Holy Spirit – or for Him to be able to access us. As the Lord did not really begin to move in Torben’s life until after his 40 days of fasting.
    ‘This kind cannot come out accept by prayer AND FASTING.

    There is definitely a spiritual principle of Holy Spirit POWER in the life of any servant who FASTS (and prays).

    God bless you all

    David Marsh.

  92. David Marsh Jul 2nd 2013

    Andrew,
    I am indeed in travail for Him. He is the only One who can reach the lost and save them and heal them. i could stand up in public and mime these activities but with Him nothing would be accomplished. My tears fall for them and because I am so helpless without Him.
    Thank you Andrew H., you have encouraged me.
    God bless you,

    David.

  93. David Marsh Jul 2nd 2013

    Please let me amend that:
    ‘ i could stand up in public and mime these activities but without Him nothing would be accomplished.

    David.

  94. Terry Jul 2nd 2013

    David,

    I am going to disagree with you a little here and say that it is both much easier and much harder than fasting. God wants our heart, not our works. I would just worry about getting to know God because wrapped up in God is the supernatural. Your purpose and direction are also wrapped up in him. Only things done in obedience will yield eternal rewards, and he can pour his power out on you when you are ready.

    He a brilliant, all-powerful God, and has creative exploits that he can tailor specifically for you if you fully yield yourself to him. What can you do – seek to know God with your whole heart. That is what you can do. I am no Torben. That is just my take as a fellow believer.

    -Terry

  95. Andrew Jul 2nd 2013

    Well said, Terry

    Bless you!

    Andrew Strom

  96. Hi David ,

    It’s great that for the most part everyone is very encouraged by Torbens videos and I would highly recommend you do a google search and watch some others of Torben that can be found with more of his message on churchplanting and discipleship they are fantastic.

    Its good that you have seen Stuart, he is a real character for sure.
    If it be through Stuart ,Torben or someone else the key message the Lord is trying to deliver is that Mark 16:15-18 is for all Christians, it shows His will and purpose.

    We can find elsewhere in the Bible special giftings and ministries as the Holy Spirit wills .
    But Jesus is addressing all believers of Mark 16: 15 – 18.
    Torben takes new christians etc out to pray for the sick to show that it is for every believer.
    It is the out working of God for those who believe ,yes for all believers.

    There is a real danger that people start to focus on the messenger as being specially anointed and thereby attribute everything to a special anointing , and in this case in direct opposition to the main point of the message.

    However it is proper to recognise the message and thank the messenger (we see the verse in scripture that talks about receive a Prophet and receive a Prophets reward) it gives encouragement when you acknowledge Gods work and helps them to keep going.

    For near on two thousand years satan has pulled people into false traditions to try and stop the spreading of the gospel.
    Jesus said “Go”.

    When we repented and received forgiveness in Jesus Christ we were made clean and worthy.
    He has done it all, through Him we have unmerited favor not because of our works as the world would think.

    God help us to do His will.

    God bless you,

    Grant

  97. Hi Markus,

    I took the time to view some of the full length versions of the short clips in the video.
    Torben does more than you have given credit or discredit for.
    I think that people are reacting at him praying for peoples backs with their legs outstrecthed and may not like it because of some of the abuses around praying lsimilar to this in the past.
    What some people fail to appreciate that muscle tension, pain , bone displacement , shortning of the tendons can all be factors in back problems so it doesn’t mean their leg has grown each time, but God rather causeing the body to come back into His divine order and unique design which we fail to account for.
    As for headaches , well if you have got one you will know when its gone, and some of the people you pray for will certainly let you know.
    In some way I wish he hadn’t shown praying for backs the way he did but then if your not prepared to even assess the rest of the video let alone his ministry it will lead you to jump to wrong conclusions.
    Jesus used spit and mud on a blind man, no doubt that caused a bit of a stir as well

    As a parting testimony one of my workmates at the airport was into sports and ruptured his archilles tendon and struggled for weeks to barely walk around .
    I offered to pray for him three times, at the third offer he said go on then I told him to be ready for it at 7pm that night because we would pray for him at that time.On return to work and this man a non believer he said it happened like you said at 7pm a warm feeling happened in my leg and I was completely healed.
    One of my co workers said “the power of positive thinking” to him.
    He replied I been $#@$#$ positively thinking for weeks and nothing happened, this was God!.
    Sometime after that the man who had witnessed results of the healing and called it positive thinking gave his life to Christ.
    And by the way the man who was healed later that day went for a several km run at his lunchtime.
    I know its very hard nowadays with some of the false things that have gone on not to react before we have properly investigated things
    Have a closer look at Torben ministry etc.
    I hope that this can bring some encourgement to press into God .

    To God be all the Glory and may our eyes be on Jesus always.

    A brother in Christ,

    Grant

  98. David m Jul 2nd 2013

    Let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, and slow to wrath. Thanks for your comments, Grant. The Lord does truly Love “just balances”.
    To Marylin Crow…what an awesome poem of truth.

    blessings to All,

    David m

  99. Kevin Jul 2nd 2013

    Grant Sutton,

    You said above ;
    “But Jesus is addressing all believers of Mark 16: 15 – 18.”

    Yes , I have always believed this and had said in a post on this thread ;

    “The above verses are saying if we believe and know Jesus we can use His authority over the works of the enemy , as do the following verses ;”

    Luk 10:17 The seventy-two returned with joy, saying, “Lord, even the demons are subject to us in your name!”
    Luk 10:18 And he said to them, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.
    Luk 10:19 Behold, I have given you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall hurt you.

    ++++

    Grant , what I have noticed over the years is how much contention is stirred up over this .

    I remember once starting a thread quoting these verses , stating that deliverance is for all believers , and the bulk of the comments opposed that saying that deliverance if a specific ministry ,where i believe and have seen from my own walk with Christ that deliverance is for every believer , for it is simply Christs authority over the works of the enemy.

    Having said this , deliverance isn’t the answer for all problems , so we need to be guided as to what to do , especially with believers who are sick through unconfessed sin ;

    Jas 5:16 Therefore, confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous person has great power as it is working.

    All believers can walk in the above mentioned areas of healing the sick and afflicted .

    Praise you Lord Jesus Christ

    that whom so ever you set free

    can set others free

    Bringing glory to your name !

  100. Andrew Jul 2nd 2013

    Well-said Grant. I wish everyone would watch more of Torben’s videos and teachings before they comment.

    Bless you!

    Andrew Strom

  101. I understand what you’re sharing David (Marsh) regarding hunger… :-)

    Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness for they shall be filled… :-)

    I’m personally encouraged when I see God creating hunger in me – and dissatisfaction – because I know that means He’s calling me to that deeper place with Him… :-)

    We are – in our identity, acceptance and inheritance – perfectly righteous in Christ – He has made us completely acceptable to God – but as He practically increases our hunger for practical righteousness and a practical expression of the passion of God for salvation expressed through us – then we start to be clothed with Power from On High – I see this as a process – deeper and deeper hunger and deeper and deeper filling – and then more and more hunger – I don’t see any of us as ever “arriving” in that sense and there is no striving in this – I sense you know this – but maybe some others don’t so I’ll share it anyway… :-)

    There is no striving to try and attain something in terms of our position with the Lord – we are fully accepted and acceptable – fully loved by the Lord – but as we see Him more we want to become more and more like Him and we want to see His Kingdom come, His will be done on earth as it is in heaven…

    He said when He was here, “Heal the sick, raise the dead, cast out demons”…

    We – those who have been infused with this hunger – want to “rise up” as it were to take hold of that level of faith with Him…

    It is a stripping process and a replacement process…

    We follow His leading – He will always meet every desire of our heart in Him – our new heart only has righteous desires (which are placed in them by the Lord) and thus He will satisfy all of these desires… :-)

    No matter how misunderstood we might be… :-)

    God has His timing in all things and we must be patient – but it will surely come – that time when we will walk in that reality in His Power (I know this for you) – no effort from anywhere else – in peace and freedom – and clarity (I see this for you – a mantle of authority through humility – a sound mind controlled by Christ – I see this for you – to be able to stand and administer His Power and Blessing to others as He releases it to you – Thank You Lord – you will do this – in your nation and in other nations – I know this – you are to be used as a forerunner and a demonstration of what is to come – the fullness of what Smith Wigglesworth saw and shared with Lester Sumrall)…

    Love you brother,

    Andrew

    Ps. Yes to what you shared regarding Tommy Hicks vision)

  102. Grant – I agree with your comments about the healing of backs, and I say this with authority in Jesus’ Name as one whom the Lord healed (exactly as seen in the video) through the laying on of hands upon my feet. It was in the late seventies and I was near to term with my youngest daughter. My back was in excruciating pain that seared from neck to tailbone. A brother phoned me saying the Lord gave him a word for me to go to a prayer meeting at a little backwoods cabin in our area. I knew no one there, and Initially I had no intention of going, but long story short – I went out of obedience because the Lord led me to go in such a way that was truly remarkable. I was not looking for nor was I expecting healing, yet that is what I received with the laying on of hands upon my feet (I had no idea one leg was shorter than the other). The brother who laid hands upon me first had a word of knowledge about my sore back (which I had disclosed to not a soul there), and then the Lord led him to lay hands upon my feet. I have never experienced that back pain again to this very day. Our Great Physician healed me and in such a miraculous turn of events. What a blessed and unexpected experience – truly precious and it so encouraged me the Lord even as I speak Praise God, and bless you brother.

  103. PCardorn Jul 3rd 2013

    You’re right Andrew when you say those who viewed or went to the Todd Bentley circus are cautious.
    However, my thot has always been this. ….If they truly have a healing ministry, why not take it to the childrens hospitals where there are documented cases of illness. Why not take it to cancer centers………..
    The days of the circus’s have to end.

  104. goodwordtoday Jul 3rd 2013

    I thought that it was WONDERFUL and the prayers were so simple–nothing long and drawn out. And that he had other people who had NEVER prayed for someone before for healing praying and seeing that miracles are part of the every day life of true Christianity. I remember at a church I used to attend when we lived in Florida, there was a man who came for a week and worked with the children. At a service on Sunday he had the children pray for people for healing. Simple little prayers and many were healed.

    I think that fear and embarrassment holds most people back from praying for others, talking to them about Christ, about living the life of a disciple.

    There is such a joy about this man – I don’t wonder why.

    I am greatly disturbed by the cynical attitude of most people on this website. But I am not surprised since many of the postings here are negative. Also, most Christians in America have never seen physical miracles. It’s a rare event for the deaf to hear, the blind to see, and the crippled to walk. Those are miracles indeed which are few and far between in the western church. And since hardly anyone takes the gospel to WalMart or a shopping mall or even to the hospitals, we have become accustomed to a religion without power.

    You people need to wake up and pray that God will stir your hearts to expectation again, to Book of Acts stuff. Acts are still being written you know (at least spiritually). The Holy Spirit didn’t stop working because Luke stopped writing. Those who think that are just so sadly deluded.

    You cynics – see if you can do better and go lay hands on and pray for someone for healing and see what happens. And don’t forget to tell them about Jesus.

  105. Torben has a humble, lowly, smiling way about him that I find interesting because these nowadays healers have one thing in common: a cocky, arrogant attitude that I truly despise. That being said, truth is truth, no matter if it comes from a person, a rock or a donkey. However, this characteristic just made me keep watching the video all the way through.
    Beautiful to see God’s miracles happening, and refreshing to see it done this way.

  106. I watched the video and was amazed at the glory of God shining on Torben’s face. You very seldom see that anymore as most churches are filled with people who are spiritually dead. Between replacing the Holy Spirit with programs and new age teachings instead of solid biblical truth, there is no spiritual life left. This Danish evangelist is filled with the Holy Spirit and ministering to all he is lead to with signs and wonders following just like Jesus said. If we all did this, many more would be saved.

    After watching the video I went to his web site and discovered many more videos to watch plus his personal testimony. He allowed God to strip him of everything and God has now raised him up to teach others and share what he has learned. His books are also available for download for free.

    Starting in August, he is offering a free on-line bible school. I immediately signed up for it and forwarded the link to the video and bible school information to my pastor, as well as some of my Christian friends. My prayer partner signed up for the bible school and my pastor is praying about showing some of the videos in church to encourage others to step out in faith.

    I think the reason so many people are attacking this video is because of fear of failure and unbelief. To go up to people you don’t know and trust God to heal and deliver them is pretty scarey. Especially since our own attempts to pray for others or even ourselves have not always reaped the same positive results. We first must come to the end of ourselves where we really know we cannot do anything by our own abilities or power. It has to be by the power of God working through us so God gets all the glory.

    Over the years I have been horrified how so many Christian ministries charge money for every little thing and are living in luxury. But this humble man believes as I do that what we are freely given we freely give back to others. We look to God to supply our needs…not fleece the sheep to get more material things. This alone proves he is a true servant of Jesus Christ. God bless him richly.

    Thanks also, Andrew, for sharing this video. I am so excited about getting the opportunity to go to bible school so I can be used more and more for the glory of God.

  107. Hi Andrew….I think much of he cynicism comes from the mess out there via Bethel and Todd Bentley etc…..It can be hard not to become cynical. I trusted what you said about this man, so watched the videos with interest. It really provoked me. Currently I am reading the Book of Acts, and it is making me crazy! I know that we are not to put miracles first….they lived a life, clearly, that marked them, and their consecration was deep….but it is also obvious when one reads Acts and the NT, that the gospel story was preached accompanied by signs and wonders. After I watched the clip, I shared a bit about it with friends. I have been reluctant to pray for healing, even though in our missionary years we did see a fair number of healings and have seen some here as well. For me, I thought, even if only one person in a hundred is healed when I pray, that’s more than will be healed if I never pray for people. I loved how short and simple his prayers were too. I found it very inspiring and compelling, and it impacted me. The next day I saw a friend whose thyroid has been wrecked via radiation for hyperthyroid, so now he doesn’t have a functioning thyroid. I asked him in the parking lot of the gym if I could pray for him and so did so. I haven’t seen him and don’t know if he was healed, but I intend to keep it up. Thank you

  108. david wilson Jul 3rd 2013

    Having come from a Pentecostal background I am a great believer in healing. I have a physical problem at present, when i was prayed for recently i expected healing, i wasnt! my tablets were increased and i was left quite surprised, as was the friend who prayed with me…We need healing..it is part of who we are as members as the body of Christ. We also need repentance-souls being won into the kingdom of God by hearing and accepting the Gospel-that Jesus died to save them. I am personally happy that if Andrew recommends someone then this should be enough for us…Remember: when Smith wigglesworth prayed for people – they were healed, including the ones he actually hit!! When todd bentley prays for those to be healed, those he hits end up in hospital..there is a difference..I want to see people saved..i want to see people healed, otherwise many millions in the UK will be lost to a Christless eternity

  109. marty Jul 3rd 2013

    I don’t know anything about Torben but I believe based on his history that Andrew would not recommend anyone like this without seeing first hand the miracles he talks about.

    However the video is similar to those that are shown by so many false prophets / teachers that anyone that does not know Torben would not know what to think. I believe that these days, extraordinary claims should be backed by solid proof. Especially in this day of “Christian” wolves doing anything to get rich. Many things could be done to separate the real from the false videos such as:

    1. Have interviews and contact information from doctors or other medical professionals to back up miracles.

    2. Instead of leg lengthening, bodily pains, and other easy to fabricate miracles, show miracles that can’t be faked such as limb restoration, obviously crooked body parts straightened, obvious physical trauma healed live, etc.

    I have seen such miracles with solid medical evidence to back them up. My own daughter born with Crouzons syndrome and multiple birth defects is an example. Unfortunately, In these days when the Lords name and power has been so abused by so many, the standard for proof must be high.

  110. Miss P Jul 3rd 2013

    Andrew said a great thing – “We cannot just be focused on what is “wrong”. At some point
    we have to be about establishing what is ‘right'”

    Establish what is RIGHT! KNOW the TRUTH! Let GOD deal with the errors – WE are not the judge.

    I thank God we are seeing healings. I thank God that Torben didn’t babble on and on with vain mindless ranting prayers…he prayed with faith – according to the Bible.
    You nay-sayers need to be very careful about what you attribute to the flesh or the devil etc.

  111. Jda016 Jul 3rd 2013

    I have heard also that sometimes when prayers are made a condition will get worse. I believe that is because the particular sickness is demonic in nature. If the devil can scare us off by making the affliction more severe, then he has stopped us from praying. I believe that when this happens we are to continue to pray and rebuke the demon and “press in” and not give up.

    Has anyone else ever encountered this?

  112. Yes Jonathan, things will often come to a “climax” as the breakthrough approaches – as things (demonic things) are ready to “come out” – or “manifest”… :-)

  113. Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013

    I may posted on the wrong video. This one is probably more appropriate…

    Yes, that leg thing reminds me very much of Simon the sorcerer in Acts. It’s a trick. Whether this guy is actually doing some healing or not, it immediately discredit’s his message. It seems like he might just be naive.

    Any chiropractic will tell you that people that have tension in their hips, butt, etc, will appear as having a different length from one leg to the other. And, if you hold the legs up in the fashion that this man is doing, they will naturally appears as if they are growing, because the muscles are stretching out. i stopped watching right there. I might watch more later, but that’s a serious put off. It’s the standard 80′s trickery, whether intentional or not.

    Let’s see a man with no leg, and see that grow out.

  114. Trent – In reference to your post and mine above I want to clarify with you and others here that in my healing no foot lifting occurred, no manipulating of my leg or foot; simply a laying on of hands and at the moment I watched my foot extend I felt what I can only describe as a ‘white heat’ and a sensation like warm air pushing my foot from my ankle along. In articulating how I felt being healed to others I have often said that it is simply as natural as breathing. God heals short legs and the resulting associated back pain as I am His living witness to this very supra-natural fact. Bless God brother (Lois / aka Gramma)

  115. Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013

    I did the same thing to my brother, just a few minutes ago. no praying involved. Nothing supernatural, just pure stretching. The guy on the video lifts the legs up.

  116. Andrew Jul 3rd 2013

    Trenton – just like I warned about-

    YOU COMMENTED WITHOUT ACTUALLY WATCHING THE WHOLE VIDEO.

    You wrote the guy off, passed judgment, scornfully and cynically attacked him – all without the courtesy of actually watching the whole clip.

    I find that very sad – and very dangerous.

    Bless you!

    Andrew Strom

  117. Kenny Atnip Jul 3rd 2013

    Praise God for moving in our midst.

    Too bad for those who carry a bag of stones seeking any excuse to stone God’s children. Jesus told us we would know men by their fruits, it should not surprise us that there are some among us who hate us.

    :(

  118. Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013

    Also, I’m not questioning that God heals even our small ailments. What I’m saying is that we should not be lifting someone’s legs, and claiming it was God. It’s a cheap trick, whether the person doing it intends it to be or not. Lois, your incident may have actually been a healing. I’m greatly concerned with what I saw in the video. I cannot, without the leading of the Holy Spirit, speak as to whether anyone was actually healed or not, but it does NOT look good.

  119. Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013

    Andrew, this sort of trickery has happened for the last 30 years. We need to not be accepting this sort of stuff. If someone who actually heals people, is doing stuff like this, they need to be warned. It’s that simple. I’m not saying the guy is not saved, or any such thing. It’s not an attack. Why do Christians have to be so sensitive? Why do Christians have to be so above others that they can’t accept a little bit of criticism? Where’s the humility? Well, quite simply, it virtually doesn’t exist in the body of Christ. :(

  120. Andrew Jul 3rd 2013

    Trenton – you are wrong.

    I am actually asking you to do a very simple thing-

    WATCH THE WHOLE VIDEO – NOT JUST ONE LITTLE SNIPPET.

    Then at least your comments may be worth hearing.

    Bless you!

    Andrew Strom

  121. Trent rest assured that in seeking to be led by the Holy Spirit in all matters as you earnestly seek He will reveal His truth to you in this, as in all matters. God bless you brother.

  122. Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013

    As I said before, I probably will be watching the whole video later. I just don’t have time at work. It won’t change my view of the beginning of the video, I’m certain of it.

  123. Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013

    I should mention something that I did not mention previously. My dad was one of the people on this planet, whom I would personally say loved God more than anyone I know. He healed people on a fairly regular basis too. I have NEVER seen someone preach better than he, BY A LONG SHOT. I don’t think anyone I’ve ever heard, was quite literally even half as good. Mainly because his love for God came from the bottom of his heart, and in fact it was a gift from God. He was a man who had a damascus experience. In fact, he was upset after he was saved, because non of the people he knew, who were Christians, would tell him about Jesus. Jesus himself had to do so.

    Guess what, my dad did the leg thing. That didn’t invalidate his ministry, he was just naive in some areas. But, it sure looked bad.

  124. Dianne Jul 3rd 2013

    Andrew, Thanks for sending the Torben video. Yes we do need to see healings take place today and it is so good to see someone who has the faith in Jesus to go out and pray for people to be healed.
    There will always be cynical people around Andrew But we know healings are for today. Keep the videos coming. They are a blessing..
    I got saved during a revival in N.Z. in 1967 and I saw healings take place. People getting out of wheelchairs totally healed. people who had polio being healed and so much more.
    God Bless you Andrew and keep up the good work.

  125. Kenny Atnip Jul 3rd 2013

    Trenton D. Adams Jul 3rd 2013 ~ “As I said before, I probably will be watching the whole video later. I just don’t have time at work. It won’t change my view of the beginning of the video, I’m certain of it.”

    Perhaps you should not have spoken out against the guy until you knew what you were speaking about. You should repent brother and retract your accusation.

  126. Lightning Storm Jul 3rd 2013

    Trenton D. Adams says the following:

    ” I cannot, WITHOUT THE LEADING OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, speak as to whether anyone was actually healed or not, but it does NOT look good.”

    _________________________________

    I ask you Trenton: If your are NOT Walking by the Holy Spirit, Spirit Controlled, Under the Spirit’s Authority……then pray tell……Why on Earth are you speaking, writing, and clearly making decisions in your FLESH?

    Anything of the FLESH is SIN. It grieves and quenches the Holy Spirit; the FLESH PROFITS NOTHING; AND ALL SIN IS DESTRUCTIVE.

    The FLESH ONLY PRODUCES SIN…..DESTRUCTION.

  127. Trenton D. Adams Jul 4th 2013

    To answer your question Lightning. On that thing, I am. I cannot comment on the rest of the video is what I mean. That leg thing is purely wrong, plain and simple.

    So, you seem to be a super spiritual man, who’s always walking by the holy spirit. Did God tell you that this holding up of the legs is of God?

  128. Trenton D. Adams Jul 4th 2013

    Yeah, watched the whole video. I still don’t believe in that leg thing. I watched my brother’s leg come out today, in about the same amount of time as he did with that girl. Tension does some nasty things to our bodies.

    Andrew, you said you know this guy personally, right? Could you get contact information for those people he “healed” and confirm they are still healed? Maybe skype with them and what not? People that get excited, will see their pain leave, and it really feels like it’s healed. Then, it comes back after the service. Jesus told people to go show themselves to the priest, thereby proving they are healed.

    Does he have videos of lepers being healed? That would be really awesome. All of the things in the video, are like any false prophet healing, very difficult to verify. That, by no means, makes him a false prophet. I’m just saying, none of it is verifiable by anyone. And, Jesus seemed to be a big proponent of verifying healing. But, I think that’s too logical for most, and isn’t “of the spirit”.

  129. Pastor Brian Bennett Jul 4th 2013

    Andrew I saw the video and we operate like this all the time.
    Faith is all that will [please God Not self empowered judgement or legalism, and certainly not doubt.

    I hope one day that the church will awaken out of religiousness and come into the need meeting power of the Holy Spirit. For the Kingdom of God to advance in love power and holiness.

    In Jesus name Amen

    PS That technique was trained to myself and many of my friends by Charles and Fanciss Hunter 20 plus years ago and I still employ it today. Praise the Lord

    Pastor Brian

  130. Barry Coe Jul 4th 2013

    Andrew, you trust this guy because you stayed in his house. But the NAR prophets whose house you never stayed in, you give adverse negative comments. The truth is that the people of the ‘last reformation’ and that of the ‘new apostolic reformation’ both give the same emphasis to signs and wonders. If staying in their houses enable us to make good judgement and not the bible as the plumb line, then most if not all of us are not qualified to make comments, for or against.

  131. Trenton D. Adams Jul 4th 2013

    Pastor Brian (Jesus: call no man pastor)

    PS That technique was trained to myself and many of my friends by Charles and Fanciss Hunter 20 plus years ago and I still employ it today. Praise the Lord

    ————————————————————————————————-

    Yes, goes to show how naive the church is. I bet you’ve been involved with all sorts of “teaching”. These days, everything is taught of men, rather than by the Holy spirit. Heck, I’ve seen people try to “teach” someone how to speak in tongues.

    Barry, you’re right. Staying in one’s house should have no bearing on how we judge. Judging should be of the Holy Spirit. I know what people are, sometimes before I even meet them. I know what their problems are, the moment I meet them. Judging by the Spirit requires absolutely not physical presence, or knowledge of the person. Unfortunately, the church is devoid of wisdom, and is not even fit to judge. And in fact, many think that you MUST meet the person, and get to know them, before you judge. But, as God says, we are not to judge by appearance.

  132. Andrew Jul 4th 2013

    Great – the cynical “negativity-mongers” are taking over again.

    Just like in the days of Jesus.

    Sad.

    -Andrew Strom

  133. Trenton D. Adams Jul 4th 2013

    Come now Andrew. You know very well that I very much believe in signs and wonders! Being *real* is not negativity. You wouldn’t be saying this if this were a discussion of Todd Bentley.

    As Christians, we must always be humble enough to admit we could be wrong. We need to be able to challenge our beliefs throughout our entire walk with God. If we can’t honestly do that, then perhaps we’re not walking as closely with God as we think?

    Anyhow, I’m done now, I don’t think this is the age of truth, after all.

  134. Trent I don’t hear the voice of the Spirit in your tone or words. What I hear is disdain toward hearts you have no business judging. That’s God’s business, not ours. Judge not lest we be judged brother. Honestly, I am waiting on the Lord for HIS confirmation with regard to this matter, and have a lively hope that He is at the helm of this ministry.

  135. Barry Coe Jul 4th 2013

    Yes Andrew, the very cynical ‘negative mongers’ are the very words the NAR prophets are calling you when you blasted them with negative comments. Since when did negative comments by you on others you disagree with deemed as discernment but those who disagree with you as ‘negative mongers’. Let the readers debate freely and we can tell those that are biblically sound and those that are extra biblically man’s teachings.

  136. Trenton D. Adams Jul 4th 2013

    Judge not, lest we be judged, is a common way of silencing the truth Lois. I’m not surprised you would use such a scripture, not one bit. As I’ve said, modern day Christians have serious problems questioning their beliefs, and being challenged in any way. I think we could look back on how Moses did it, and maybe learn a little humility.

  137. Trenton D. Adams Jul 4th 2013

    Also, I want to make sure it’s still clear in everyone’s minds. I’m still not saying that Toben was not genuinely healing people. I’m saying that this leg thing should not be done. We should not replicate the ways of the heathen.

  138. C’mon now Trent – this leg thing? Are you saying that I wasn’t healed? The Lord healed my leg – laying of hands upon my feet, my back healed. Choose your words more carefully brother and examine your heart.

    Andrew – Stay the course and as for this matter I have nothing more to share – God Bless.

  139. Lightning Storm Jul 4th 2013

    Trenton D. Adams

    You consider Walking by the Spirit as SUPER SPIRITUAL?

    Walking by the Spirit is the BASIC REQUIREMENTS of being a FOLLOWER of Jesus Christ.

    Not even close to being the SUPER SPIRITUAL OVERCOMER OF THE BOOK OF REVELATION.

  140. Christine Roberts Jul 4th 2013

    Hello Andrew, i watched the video directly from your link on the email, and also his testimony, which I would like our youth group to see. Will follow-up on that with the leader. It is great, and helps to re-focus on what matters. Strangely as I was watching the testimony video I was thinking “I wonder if Andrew Strom knows about this guy, and if he has any comments” … forgetting momentarily that i got the lead from your email ! doh!!
    thank you for your continuing ministry, Christine

  141. So how many of these people will be in a Bible believing Church now? I forgot all you can do is critizize churches. And where is the go and sin no more? Just slam-bam your healed bbfn !

  142. Barry Coe Jul 4th 2013

    Lois, this frequent and wrongly use of the judge not that you not be judged thing is what helps propagate the false gospels and like teachings and allow false teachers and prophets a free rein to deceive the brethren. It is often the ‘yes man’ in churches that think it is righteous not to ‘judge’ (even if it is a case of righteous judgement) that cause downfall of pastors. Touch not the anointed and get deceived is the reality.

    An on going case is the super mega church called City Harvest Church in Singapore where for years members followed this mantra and now finally the Sr Pastors and 5 other leaders are in court facing charges of misuse of funds . The wife of the senior pastor who performed the lewd ‘ChinaWine’ music dance was endorsed by the church as a ‘cross over’ project at evangelism. It turned more unbelievers away than bring them to Christ. You can watch this China Wine on youtube but don’t be afraid to judge. Discern, evaluate, assessment (in place of the offensive word judgement) of people and situation are things we do daily, when electing our political leaders, in choosing life partners, in doing financial business with people , in presiding a disciplinary case etc etc. Are the annointed exempted from it that what they do and teach must be taken as divine and they cannot err. Too many yes man spoil the pastors, teachers and prophets. When the Godly people of God choose to say nothing, or do nothing false teachers will abound.

  143. Lightning Storm Jul 4th 2013

    Many of these “naysayers” have revealed what a small god they believe in.
    And what a small POWERLESS Holy Spirit we have been given.

    A small god that NEEDS the help of mankind (namely THEMSELVES) to take down the purveyors of the darkness and protect the other people (the poor stupid sheep that don’t know as much as the naysayers)

    What GOOD IS THE HOLY SPIRIT in this kind of thinking?

    What is the PURPOSE of SENDING the Holy Spirit to dwell in us, if He is absolutely USELESS TO KEEP US, TRANSFORM US, AND CONFORM US INTO OVERCOMERS IN THE IMAGE OF JESUS CHRIST?

    The MANIFESTATION OF GOD’S GLORY in healings and miracles, etc, is the OUTFLOW/OVERFLOW of the Holy Spirit’s RESPONSE to a person who BELIEVES IN HIM AND HONORS HIM AS GOD……CO-EQUAL WITH THE FATHER AND JESUS CHRIST.

  144. Jda016 Jul 4th 2013

    Dear Andrew Strom,

    Remember, you are the authority of this site and have power over what is discussed. You have every right to delete or silence anything you feel is not of God.

    By all means, allow honest and earnest discussion, but you do not have to contend with people who have no desire to listen to anything other than themselves.

    I trust your judgment Andrew, that is why I am on your mailing list! =). Do not be afraid of what people might or might not say if you delete or ban what you feel is not of God.

    I trust your judgement.

    Be encouraged and have peace. You do not have to stand by and do nothing.

    Bless you Andrew. Thank you for everything that you have done. Thank you for your mailing list and the chance to respond to what you post. I just really feel that God would encourage you even now. Do not be disheartened!

    You have authority here.

    God bless you abundantly!

    Jonathan

  145. Hi All,

    Just a comment on the leg praying method.
    Our humanity or maybe it could be said our sinful nature constantly looks for predictability in our efforts with conformity to methods.
    God looks for faith, trust and obedience in Him rather than relying on our traditions etc.
    Surrender of doing “it my way” for “His way” is what the Lord delights in and expects.
    I will give you a personal experience example.
    As a result of the anointing, often before ministering healing my hands will become quite hot to the touch.
    I then started to place quite an importance on that experience personally when praying for people.
    One night I was in a house group meeting of about 15 people and the Lord told me there was a man with an ankle injury to pray for.
    When I asked, the man came forward ,it was an old football injury, my hands were hot and I put them around his ankle.
    To my shock they went ice cold , I was concerned and that this happened and turned to my wife and whispered my concern.
    I then asked the man how his ankle was, he replied something like “its fine… funny that it would always give me trouble in the summer heat but was much better in the cold of winter”.
    God knew what was needed and I had put Him in a warm anointing healing method box.
    He froze the ankle and totally healed it, mean while I thought the cold couldn’t be His work.
    It was absolutely the Lord , if you had tried to convince me that God would freeze an injury to heal it , I wouldn’ t have accepted it.
    Haven’t ever heard of this happening before or since, but it was genuine.
    So if you are convinced God wants you to pick legs up to pray for them, do it.
    I think the Lords more interested in the person being made whole and your faithfullness to His leading especially when the bible doesn’t condemn doing it.

    God bless you,

    Grant

  146. Barry Coe Jul 4th 2013

    Lightning Storm,
    The Holy Spirit is real. He is member of our triune God , the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit.

    He is God with us and in us, a pledge of our inheritance in .Christ, a holy people unto God. He is our comforter, our teacher, our counsellor and our helper in a very supernatural way. He that is in us is greater than he that is without. We should call on Him daily to be filled with His Spirit. He fills us not so we speak in tongues or perform signs and wonders but that we will be strengthened supernaturally, be transformed supernaturally and be sanctified daily supernaturally for without his help we can do nothing. He gives gifts whenever and to whoever he pleases for edification of the brethren, the furtherance of the gospel that brings repentance and salvation and the glory of God but not for entertainment or for some mystical experiences.

    Being filled with the spirit must be continual and not so we can speak in tongues or to possess power gifts. But rather it is a supernatural empowering to enable us to live lives as doers of the word and not hearers only. Like a a ship with its sail opened up to catch the wind that powers the vessel, the Holy Spirit fills our being and empowers us to live a life consistent with His word and will. He does not need us to hold on to some word of faith teachings to empower us but merely that we surrender our will and lives to His divine will , control and empowerment. Incidentally discernment is a gift of the Holy Spirit rarely or even never sought especially for fear of making ‘judgement’ or being seen as negative.

  147. Lightning Storm Jul 4th 2013

    Barry Coe

    I rattled off doctrine that I memorized for 30 years and wasn’t even born again.

    I practiced evangelism and apologetics (loved to invite the Mormons and the Witnesses into the home) for 30 years also……and wasn’t even born again.

    Only Faith (Trust; Dependence; Reliance) in the Living Word of God pleases God.

  148. Lightning Storm Jul 4th 2013

    Rom 13:10 KJV – LOVE worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore LOVE [is] the fulfilling of the law.

    If the Holy Spirit is in CONTROL of a born again believer, He has the RIGHT to LOVE A PERSON anyway He wants to!

    The Holy Spirit also has the RIGHT to CONVICT, PERSUADE, AND DRAW ALL MANKIND TO REPENTANCE AND SALVATION ANYWAY He wants to!

    Why do people think that the Holy Spirit MUST OBEY THEIR WAYS AND THEIR THOUGHTS?

  149. Barry Coe Jul 4th 2013

    Lightning Storm,
    Quote: ‘ Why do people think that the Holy Spirit must obey their ways and their thoughts’
    May I know who among the comments made said that. Tell me who, otherwise it is best not to dramatise. The Holy Spirit only minister according to His will and in line only with the word of God and not the extra biblical teachings of man. He points man to Christ and His saving grace and glorifies God. Yes brother, many people can know plenty of doctrines and not be born again like Nicodimus. That is because they were into religion and not into a personal relationship with Christ. You need the power of the Holy Spirit to convict man of their sins and lost ness without Christ and to be born again they need to have a personal relation with God through the salvation Christ offers. The Holy Spirit then resides in the believer as a pledge of his inheritance in Christ. No the Holy Spirit don’t obey man’s words or thoughts. Cheer up.

  150. Lightning Storm Jul 4th 2013

    I used those “religiously correct” terms, too.

    Like “ask Jesus into your heart”; ” a personal relationship with Jesus”; “extra biblical teachings” etc etc.

    Religion is so subtle….like the statement:

    “You (I) need the Power of the Holy Spirit to convict man….”

    WE don’t convict man…..see how subtle religion is?

    “He (the Holy Spirit) points man to Christ…..”

    Do you see what I am saying?

    A WEAK POWERLESS HOLY SPIRIT IS BEING DESCRIBED IN THESE WORDS.

    Sin and Flesh are very subtle until the Light of God EXPOSES.

  151. Tim Bennett Jul 4th 2013

    All I could do was weep while watching this video. God is real. He loves us. He wants us to work with Him. He loves people. Thank You Lord for Your mighty works! Come, Lord Jesus!

  152. Barry Coe Jul 5th 2013

    Lightening Storm,
    What’s your point or disagreement to what I said. Unless you discuss clearly and biblically, I have no idea what is on your mind. No need for lightning and storms. Cheers.

  153. Andrew Jul 5th 2013

    Tim – what a heartfelt response.

    Bless you, brother.

    Andrew

  154. Lightning Storm Jul 5th 2013

    There’s the FRUIT we should be looking for!

    Tim and many others, including myself, have expressed a DEEPER KNOWLEDGE OF WHO THE LIVING GOD REALLY IS…… and an INCREASED DESIRE TO DRAW CLOSER AND BE/WALK LIKE JESUS.

  155. Lightning Storm Jul 5th 2013

    Hbr 11:6 NASB – And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God MUST BELIEVE THAT HE IS, and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.

    It is quite clear in this verse, that you must believe that HE IS…..that GOD IS ALIVE…REAL….AND IS WHO HE SAYS HE IS…….BEFORE a person can even come to Him.

    THIS IS THE PURPOSE OF HEALINGS AND MIRACLES IN THE NT.

    GOD IS PROVING THAT HE IS REAL, ALIVE, FILLED WITH LOVE AND GOODNESS, AND CAN BE TRUSTED.

    We are to be the LIGHT AND THE SALT…..that means we are to be the vessels that CARRY THE GOODNESS OF GOD TO THE people who are being held captive in the kingdom of darkness.

    We must ALL REPENT of not being the LIGHT CARRIERS ALL THE TIME….24/7!

  156. Lightning Storm Jul 5th 2013

    PS….and those who are criticizing the GOODNESS of GOD THAT IS BEING ACCOMPLISHED IN PEOPLE’S LIVES ……..are snatching the seed of FAITH that is being planted in the people who do not KNOW God……and planting doubt, fear, and suspicion.

    Who will hold you accountable if you continue after being warned? God